Episode: 954
Title: HPR0954: All Things Chrome
Source: https://hub.hackerpublicradio.org/ccdn.php?filename=/eps/hpr0954/hpr0954.mp3
Transcribed: 2025-10-08 05:29:59

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The full circle podcast on Hacker Public Radio in this episode on Things Chrome.
Hello World and welcome to our show on Hacker Public Radio.
Cast your mind back to when the Chromebook was the latest toy.
Our own ad Hewitt had bought one, so while I stand back and referee,
listen to Ed and Dave Wilkins fight it out.
The full circle podcast is the companion to full circle magazine,
the independent magazine for the Ubuntu community.
Find us at fullcirclemagazine.org forward slash podcast.
Well I'm guessing that there's only one real opinion topic coming up now isn't there?
I think there is. I think it's going to be a developed version of Ubuntu in my head every week now,
which is the one that's a magic computer.
It's just pause on a Chromebook.
Yes, yes I have very happy with it.
It was an impulse buy out. Well, wasn't it? Well, yes and no.
I was getting really excited about it since it's kind of an announcement that the Chrome West will be going as a public pop back in May at the IO conference.
And pretty much every weekend walk into PC world asking, when are you going to get it?
Because it was due what June 15th I think in the UK, but it didn't arrive until 8th July.
So I ordered it that week. It came on Saturday morning. I was very pleased with it.
So run us run us down the spec which one have you got?
Okay, so it's the Samsung Series 5 Chromebook.
It's the premium model, the Nexus model I like to call it.
It's the Arctic white one.
Well, the reason why I call the Nexus one is because the one that Google pushes is so it's got a developer switch on it.
So it's got a developer switch on it.
What you press a button and it turns you into a developer.
Well, no, you press the button and it will unlock the boot load as you can see a different OS like Nexus does.
And you can mess around with the kernel on Chrome OS and start trying to tweak it yourself or start maybe pulling the night builds from Chromium OS.
It's just kind of, you know, if you just want to be a standard user of Chrome OS, you don't switch, you don't flick that switch.
If you want to start messing with it and try and install Windows 7 on it or try and install Mac OS 10 on it, you can do by flicking that device switch.
Let me do that.
Just to post a video on it.
It would be fairly perverse, wouldn't it?
It's quite powerful hardware.
It's got an Intel atom 570, I believe.
I think it's the right one, which is the 1.66 gigahertz dual core processor.
It's fairly fine, which does.
It's fine.
Standard Intel integrated graphics, two gigs of RAM, a 16 gig SSD.
Bachelor of life, Samsung kind of says it's about eight hours, but people are saying it's 11 and I've seen about 11 hours.
And that's pretty damn good for a notebook, I think.
I think it's supposed to be, I think it's supposed to be 80 hours continuous usage.
I don't know why that.
I remember reading it.
Yeah.
I think probably many full brightness and music blowing all the time, maybe something like that, probably.
I have compared the hardware to very much like a MacBook Air because it has, it has very much premium fields.
Yeah, you said that.
You said that as the excuse is the way, well, as the answer to me, it's the way it's so massive.
Yeah, it's big, but thin.
It's got, yeah, it's thin.
It's very light.
It's got this, it's got the huge 12.
It's not huge, but you can be on laptop standards.
It's good size.
It's a 12 inch screen, very much like the MacBook.
It's got a very large multi touch multi touch track pack.
The same sort of dimensions of the MacBook Air.
And the full size keyboard with each button is individual button, which has got huge spacing
in it very much like the MacBook keyboard.
So the Apple patterns will be all over this notebook, I think.
Well, if everybody's pushing out chiclet keyboards with violent keys, so that's a bit of a fashion fad at the moment.
It is.
I like those keys.
It is lovely to type on absolute.
It's a shame it's not backlit, though.
I would have liked that.
And I can see why it costs 350 pounds, because I know when I was going on over buying it, you know, I went into PC world,
180 quid for a bog standard Windows 7 netbook.
I think it's a 180 quid for pretty much almost the same thing.
And I went on to scan and try to configure the best PC I can for 350 pounds.
And I got myself a quad i5, 4 gigs of RAM, 300 gig hard drive and an 80i radion, 6, 800 things.
So that's pretty much a decent high end gaming machine for the same price.
It's in the middle of the middle spec gaming machine.
Yeah, okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's pretty decent for 300 pounds, though.
It is.
You can use the big crisis too on that all sorts.
So to me, I was, it just looks completely utter stupid what I've done.
But a notebook for way over the odds for which only goes on the web.
Well, I'm glad you said that, Ed, because I'm sure that myself old Dave was about to save that.
No, I said it ages ago.
Yeah, I've done, I've essentially done the whole Apple fanboy thing.
It costs so much money, but I've got to have it.
What's one of those investments, isn't it?
Never be last, never be first.
First, my man.
That's so much happiness.
Yeah.
You jumped on.
I'm sorry.
I think, I think I think I'm, I think Chrome OS is going to be a fairly stable platform.
I think the reason that they've released this and it's so expensive is that only people who are really, really keen on the Chrome OS.
I'm going to buy it because it could still, it's now in the, in the limited release phase.
Like, like, like, I'm like Google plus was a few weeks ago.
They're releasing it a little bit.
So they can, they can perfect it and eventually release mass, mass marketing versions.
Dave, I'm glad you're quite confident with the platform because I'm not.
I'm, I'm like confident to say it's going to be, it's, it's, it's doing really well because I'm not.
I'm, I'm saying boy, that maybe I've jumped too early and I hear next.
When it comes to main next year at IO, they say, yeah, we're going to drop Chrome OS.
I think.
Oh, I'm sorry, I'd be fairly, fairly funny.
It wasn't me.
Yeah.
It wouldn't be great because I, I have to spend 300 pound just for the operating system,
rather than the hardware.
But what I was getting to is that the hard, I can see why it's 300 pounds.
The hardware is premium.
It's very nice.
On, on, on the hardest, you've got two USB ports.
Just one headphone jack.
It's got VGA ports.
It has got an SD card slot.
Even though I've got the Wi-Fi model, it has got an SD card slot, which is rather odd.
So it should.
Well, yeah, but I would have thought since the Wi-Fi version, they would have moved it.
But they've left it in.
No, there's too many people running around with digital cameras and bits and pieces.
No.
Oh, sorry.
I didn't.
No, sorry.
I didn't move the SD card slot.
It has gone.
It has gone.
It has gone SD card slot.
Sorry.
But my models got the SIM card slot.
Oh, right.
Sorry.
Yeah, of course.
I got mixed up.
Sorry.
I've got those browser-specific key.
So there's no F1WIF2 anymore.
There's back forward, refresh, full screen, window switcher.
Yeah, it does support multiple desktops going, which is rather odd, I thought.
One of the first things I thought when I saw the hardware, the software, I couldn't work out
why I would want multiple desktops.
Well, you definitely would.
That's one of the things.
There's missing from Google Chrome.
If you want to use Chrome as a desktop environment replacement is multiple desktops.
You ended up with massive clutter on a single desktop.
Okay.
Dave, that's a stupid thing to say because you've got a bunch of which supports virtual desktops.
You open a, you open Chrome with a set of tabs in one desktop.
Open a new window of Chrome in another desktops.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's, that's what I do.
Well, that's fine then.
Well, I don't get, I still don't get.
I'm saying it's a good thing.
I'm saying it's a good thing.
I'm saying it's a good thing.
Sorry.
Sorry.
Okay.
So that's the hardware.
And the screen's really bright and the screen's actually really nice.
I've always thought something doing really nice displays.
And it does appear after the non-this model.
The software is all clean about.
It does boot up in eight seconds.
It does shut down instantly.
And it waits from sleep instantly.
And when I took this into work last yesterday, I showed everyone it.
Everyone just said it is just essentially Chrome.
People thought it was Chrome in a few of the things, but it's not.
It is just Chrome.
If you've used Chrome, you've used Chrome OS.
That is it.
There's nothing else.
It's Chrome.
It's just Chrome.
This is why running Chrome within Ubuntu is like Chrome OS with a few extra local features.
Which is what I'm finding with as my main laptop.
As a netbook, I'd be, I'd be, I could be persuaded to go for Chrome OS when they get Google Docs offline.
Yeah.
Yeah, that'd be good.
Yeah.
It was quite fail my demo at work.
Yes, say because I couldn't connect to the corporate Wi-Fi.
And essentially, I couldn't do anything.
Even though, even though my phone, I was covered with my phone, I could only get Wi-Fi in the building.
So, I mean, not Wi-Fi.
I could only get WAP from my phone to my, that was really slow.
Yeah.
So pretty much, it was a complete fail at trying to show anything off on it because it's Chrome without internet.
Yeah, you should have tried, you should have tried.
You should have made sure you get the internet before you do the demo.
Yeah.
I'm not really kind of, I don't, I don't think I'm really kind of doing this just this time, I really.
Well, I think it's great.
We are getting the full picture of light and shade on this one, I think.
Yeah.
I've got to be honest, I've got to be honest with you, everyone, really.
I can't say it's the best thing ever, you should all buy it.
I think most people have been saying on top of the puzzle because I think.
I think most people would have turned against you since you said you were working at Porsche.
So, I shouldn't worry about any of this.
But yeah, the issue I have with Chrome OS is, okay, let's imagine we live in the ideal Google.
The world as Google imagines it to everyone uses Google Google forever.
So, I've got my Android phone, got my app with tablets.
I've got my PC running running Chrome OS version, whatever it's going to be in the future.
You can do all these, these, these magical things.
I got my, my, my phone was running in a very Android, of course.
And then there's my tablet.
What is my tower running?
Is it running?
Is it running Android?
Is it running?
Or is it running Chrome OS?
And, and, and which one, and which one should it be running?
The idea here, the idea of, I think, of, of, of companies in cloud create the,
the same experience, same user experience on whatever device you're using.
So, I think maybe in order for Chrome to really take the next step,
it needs to look a bit more like Android.
So, the Chrome homepage already, we've got these little apps going on.
We need to, we need to see as much more of that as possible.
Dave, stop doing a Steve Balmer, please.
Because, because, yes, and Dave's answer is window date.
Google, Google, Google, Google.
It's got a good point.
Android is for touchscreen.
Chrome is for keyboard and mouse.
Don't get the two mixed up.
Okay.
Well, why, why are we, why are we, why are we thinking within these,
within these boundaries?
Why are we, why are we applying ideas to the hardware?
When we could be applying a hard, I'm the hardware to our ideas.
We're thinking, we're thinking, we're always thinking the next step, you know,
not, not, not, not constraining our, you, not constraining our user experience
within the environment, we've already built for it,
but building environment around the user, the ideal user experience.
Microsoft already discovered this in the early 2000s,
that putting a touchscreen on a desktop and a laptop doesn't work,
because you start touching all, yeah, on the screen,
it will start aching after a while.
It can't be done.
It's also annoying.
Yeah.
And Mr. Jobs said that we're not going to put a touchscreen on a desktop
for that exact same reason.
Yeah.
So everybody, everybody's in tune with that one.
But the question is, as I said, the question is the tablet.
Is what, what's the tablet running?
It's a touchscreen.
It's going to run Android.
So why, why can't we make Chrome touchscreen compatible?
Because it needs to have a little, little, little app.
Because it's a desktop, it's quite experienced.
So why, why can't the work in touchscreen as well?
It's a desktop app, which is a desktop operating system,
which runs where that can't do Android,
because how many touchscreen capabilities vice versa.
I don't really get it out here.
Well, this is, this is where some people can see Google Chrome
running out of road, if you like.
Exactly.
That's what I'm saying.
I'm seeing a single user experience,
but it has different, different offshoots.
And something that's going to give it some points.
It's, it's not a unified experience at the moment,
which, which Windows 8 is going to be.
Yeah, the question is, the question is,
rather, will the tablet become ubiquitous?
Because there was, I was listening to a couple of things last week,
and two, two different stories came up,
where some of the consumer electronics stores were relegating
the netbooks and notebooks to the back of the shop,
and the front of the shop was all tablets.
Yeah, but I think it's a bit of a fatter than my 3D.
Well, that's the question.
Yeah.
Is, is the tablet a fad,
or are we going to end up heading back
to devices that have got proper keyboards on,
in which case Google's got all the road it wants?
I can see, I can see a purpose in both of them, to be honest.
But to be honest, for me right now,
I, there's no reason for me to have a tablet.
It doesn't have, all the people I know who have tablets
who do the same things as I am, only have them,
because they've been taken into my marketing experience,
and they rarely use them for anything.
Exactly.
There's nothing wrong with the tablet.
They are side hardware, ROS, Windows 8, WebOS, iOS,
to all solid operating tablets.
Great, great.
But what did it work for?
Great.
Yeah, that's exactly the tablet is a home device,
and what do you have at home in your desktop?
What do people rather browse on their desktop?
Because it's quicker.
It's the full web experience.
It is a fan.
It's like 3D.
I think it could be a future for tablets,
but we just need to decide what it is before we start leaving
up any cliffs here.
The tablets are slowly but surely infiltrating new areas.
I don't know, Dave, if you were talking to Alan on Monday,
Alan Sands, he's got his tablet from work.
He's in the construction industry,
and he's getting a lot of the construction paperwork
downloaded onto the tablet,
because he doesn't have to do an awful lot of changes to it.
It's a different kind of content consumption.
All he's got to do is check in and out certain construction documents
as they're working through the project,
but he doesn't have to do any substantial changes to it.
It's that class of content consumption,
whereas as soon as you need to do any content creation,
you need to go back onto something that's got a proper keyboard.
That does make sense to me.
Today, for the first time, about an hour ago,
I desired a tablet because I've run out of money.
I can't buy any books,
and I need to read a load of books.
I don't really want to have to do it on my desktop all the time.
I can't count my desktop around,
and my desktop's big and bulky.
It's a fixed screen.
I like reading books.
Fight by Kindle.
I can't afford the e-books either.
Your problem, Dave, isn't the wrong technology.
It's the fact that you haven't got any money at all.
You just said you've got no money,
but I'm thinking about buying a tablet.
That's far more important than a Kindle.
That's the thing I'm thinking about buying it out.
I'm saying, I wish I had a tablet.
But briefly, I don't really prefer it.
I don't even have this one purpose.
If I had a tablet in my hand right now,
I would now have a use for it.
It would be a very, very limited use.
Even saying a tablet is good for consumption,
is it though?
It's not good for reading books on,
because the colors and glare are not good for your eyes
for reading a book, so the Kindle's better for that.
When you're watching a movie,
it's far better watching on your 40-inch LCD screen,
rather than on a 9-inch tablet.
Oh, no question.
Playing games, I would rather play PC games,
and I think most people would rather play
on the Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3.
Let me stop you there.
Let me stop you there.
Music, I'm playing for my sound system, I think.
The one done crappy speakers on the set works.
Here, here, here, you've said that you've named four different devices.
The tablet is only one device.
We've just bought its task crapfully.
Yeah, but that's always the problem with the multifunction tool.
You're sacrificing performance for convenience.
It's just like, it's the Swiss Army.
Yes, Swiss Army knife there we go.
In stereo.
I am, of course, playing devil's advocate.
I mean, I don't have a tablet.
and I have no plans to get one.
But I can see what it's for.
So, to try and wind this one up
before Dave disappears, dragged by his ankles
down the stairs to the kitchen.
I was just about to say,
when's the next significant upgrade to Chrome OS expected?
It's every six weeks, like Chrome.
That's quite interesting, actually,
because I was looking through on the Chrome OS
Wiki page, looking what if on the plan is for upgrades.
This is pretty sitting in things like calculators on the way.
Shouldn't that be there from the start?
Well, one word of thought, sir.
Well, you can use Google.
I mean, you just put a thing that amounts to Google
and then it calculates it for you.
I think basically we're going to expect to see
all the advancements you'll see in the Chrome browser
bundled with all the Chrome OS specific things.
So maybe improve power management, fixes,
some new features like a calculator.
Well, I'm looking forward to it to much,
much, much more stuff that's going to be on the Chrome browser.
All right, I suspect Google's ideas are the same as mine
that need to be more out-based
and it needs to be more focused on providing a replacement
for desktops.
I think probably wrongly I could think Google on the app model
because actually, the app model for phones
was never meant to happen, actually.
Well, exactly what that's pushing.
So that happened accidentally.
Well, it happened because they were emulating the latest thing.
No, the Apple didn't mean to happen either.
If it had Steve Jobs' way, he wouldn't, Steve Jobs' way,
he wouldn't have created apps.
The original idea for the iPhone 1
was that we'd all use web apps as the apps, not digital apps.
Not downloadable things, yeah.
And it just kind of kicks off from there.
And I think even today Steve Jobs is a halfway house, isn't it?
As I said before, between having entirely local apps
and between having entirely web-based apps,
having sort of having things like Facebook, the Android app,
which is a bit like, it looks a bit like a web app,
but it works like it's a local app.
I've said this before, Dave,
but the whole point of HTML5 and what Apple want to do
and what Microsoft wants to do and what Google wants to do
is that you install the Gmail app on Chrome
and then you take that same app on the phone, on your tablet.
And that's the whole point.
Having individual apps to work on individual platforms
is going back to the same problem we've got the desktop
open to where, if I want to use Photoshop,
I have to have Windows.
The whole point is that with the web platform,
you can use on any device, any platform.
And it's really, really easy to customize as well.
Yeah, it's a pain that I've been graduating now.
I had so much more to say.
So much more to say.
Always so much.
Well, go for the classic showbiz thing
and leave them screaming for more.
We haven't even touched up on Google because of us yet.
Oh, well, yeah.
I know.
It's going to completely change the face of the web.
I mean, I've been tweeting a lot lately about Clouds.
And I think I really, really think the next few years
you're going to see Facebook being forced to partner up
with Microsoft.
And that's no sooner than I say that.
They announced their day of partnering with Skype,
which is part of Microsoft.
You do know four or five years ago Microsoft
did buy a lot of shares on Facebook.
They partnered up four or five years ago.
They had this was already in place.
It was worth $130 million worth of investment about five years ago.
This is why things like Windows Live Messenger
works with Facebook because this partnership happened years ago.
Keep up Dave.
I know five years is a long time ago in internet years.
It's like dog years.
So I've spoke about feels like about 30 years ago now,
but it did happen.
But I'm also done to believe that I don't think Apple's cloud
is going to be that great.
And Apple doesn't really have any native social networking.
And I still have rather chummy with Facebook as well.
So I think it may be Apple we've brought on as well.
And if the ultimate battle will be decided, really,
as far as I believe, by who can grab hold of services
like Lassobem, Spotify and Steam?
Apple have partnered up with Twitter
and Apple do have their social network called Ping.
And Apple's cloud is not cloud is a sync service.
Yeah, exactly.
A no-name social network, not where any people use.
And a non-existent cloud.
But it's going to be a pig with a top hat and a star.
It's going to be, I don't know, pig.
Oh, I think we're going into a whole lot.
Another couple of hours, the heat spread here.
So that was it.
We'll spare you the extra couple of hours debates
we had afterwards.
And just say thanks to Ed Hewitt,
who left the show soon after.
I don't think it was anything we said.
But then again, it might have been.
That's all for now, but we'll be back with the full circle
podcast on Hacker Public Radio very soon.
I'm Robin Kathleen.
Thank you for listening and goodbye.
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