Initial commit: HPR Knowledge Base MCP Server
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Episode: 4116
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Title: HPR4116: Response to 4109: Building community without SEO
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Source: https://hub.hackerpublicradio.org/ccdn.php?filename=/eps/hpr4116/hpr4116.mp3
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Transcribed: 2025-10-25 19:49:40
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---
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This is Hacker Public Radio Episode 4,116 from Monday the 13th of May 2024.
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Today's show is entitled, Response to 4,109, Building Community Without CO.
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It is hosted by Hobbes and is about 19 minutes long.
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It carries an explicit flag.
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The summary is, Building Community does not require marketing, and too much marketing
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can sometimes destroy community.
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Thank you, Nightwise, for your Hacker Public Radio Episode 4,109.
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Really appreciated the walk through the forest, and you're thinking about how we can make
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HPR grow and expand our community and keep it alive.
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As you pointed out, we're having trouble getting episodes recorded.
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However, I do not think that your marketing approach is the correct approach.
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I feel we need to double down on our religion, as you spoke about us being sort of like a
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convent of nuns, cloistered in our monastery or whatever.
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We do have a religion.
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We believe in open source.
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We believe in that information should be free and should be unencumbered by insidified
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platforms, such as Discord.
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So, I'll try to give you a more organized rebuttal as I record the rest of this episode.
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First, being a good rep-apportion debater, I'd like to acknowledge all the things we agree
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on.
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I think there's a lot that can be improved about the website, the intro, and the way we
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handle a comment.
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So, I really appreciate your insights there.
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I totally agree.
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There's a lot that could be improved there.
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Not so sure we need to worry too much about the short attention span of young people and
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they're perhaps the quaint introduction with the guitar episode at the very beginning.
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It is a little bit long and it is a little bit, I don't know, pedantic and citing the
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number of the episode, et cetera, but I think it is helpful and if people don't like to
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see what they can do as I do on my podcast, my podcast, and simply skip the first minute
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automatically of every episode.
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And I love that it's a predetermined length so that I can do that.
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So it's relatively straightforward for people to take the pieces of an episode that they
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like.
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You can even speed up or slow down people's voices if I'm speaking too fast.
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Feel free to slow it down on your podcast.
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Regarding the suggestion to move to discord from the comment section, I agree with you.
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I've had trouble replying to or making comments and I find it quite difficult to interact
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with a lot of the excellent speakers we have on this podcast that would love a better
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way to more easily interact.
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Recording response episodes isn't as easy as I thought it would be as I'm trying to
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do now with you.
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It's a lot easier to see the transcript or the show notes and then reply in some context
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where you have all the information at hand instead of having to try to face your rebuttal
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or your response entirely on memory.
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However, I think discord is exactly the wrong platform for such an engaged, thoughtful
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dialogue among peers who have, who share value.
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Discord is a well-known platform for exploitation of people.
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It's obviously very commercial.
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They sell your information to advertisers and to scammers.
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Every time I do sign on and I do have to sign on because some of my communities are
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managed there.
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I'm flooded with potential scammers that I have to block.
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It's full of bots and con artists and people that prey upon those who are less technically
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savvy.
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It was obviously originally a great place for gamers to interact but of course it's also
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a great place for cheaters to gather and share tools and among us hackers.
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I'm sure that's a very popular platform for gameplay and for managing their hacking
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exploits but it's not a great place for having thoughtful dialogue and in addition, it
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does work on Linux.
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If you're using an open source software and your operating system and you're trying to
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support open source, discord is exactly the wrong package to use.
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They do not support open source.
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Not only do they not open source their own products, they do not simply support open source
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operating systems or browsers.
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Their application requires you to update with their updater automatically at every time
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I have logged on.
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Admittedly, I only have logged on maybe once every couple months but every single time I've
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tried to log on, I've had to completely reinstall the desktop application and re-sign their terms
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and conditions and they do that intentionally because they are preparing for repeated rug
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poles.
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In case you haven't been following the news on MongoDB and Redis and Reddit and Terraform
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even, all these platforms where people have spent their lives contributing open source
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software to these communities, they have had the rug pulled out from under them and
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by simply changing a few sentences in the terms and conditions and that is not something
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I can withstand on any product that I will ever use.
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Any organization that threatens or even wants to leave open the possibility of a rug
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pole, they might, they can go stick their platform where the sun doesn't shine which
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is the same I can say for any other in-shitified products that you want us to utilize for managing
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this community.
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Like you, I want to be more positive than negative.
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Building community is very, very hard and I really admire the founders of Hacker Public
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Radio and the maintainers, the janitors as they call themselves.
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I love their humility and their hard work and diligence that maintain the quality of
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this podcast and the quality of the tools that they use and their reliability.
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It's just amazing that this product has remained and sustained itself for so long based entirely
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on volunteer effort.
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Communities are that sort of thing, they are built by passionate people who are giving
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of themselves freely and without any expectation of appreciation even from the community.
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They know that if they have something of valuable to give others can make use of it and it
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will be good for the world and they are putting it out there for us and it saved me from
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a bout of, we'll admit it, depression over the past couple of years, I'm a new user
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to Hacker Public Radio and I found this platform at a time when it was very well needed.
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I was becoming depressed at the world deteriorating around my eyes, becoming incitified.
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I'll rank it right up there with my discovery of Cory Doctorow in his book on incitification
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called The Internet Con.
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That might be something else that you might appreciate that you could get from this
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episode that's more positive.
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There's a whole trend around the world now of people flooding away from platforms like
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Discord and Twitter or as the founder of the new owner of Twitter would like us to call
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it, he would like us to use the letter X to describe it but of course that's not, there
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are a lot of other things that are called X so I prefer to call it shitter but using X
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is the first letter and Twitter and pronouncing it in Spanish speaking in other countries
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where Latin is the origin of their language.
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One of the places they're flocking to is an open source platform that's completely
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free of lock-in and incitification and that's Macedon and even they have tried to pull
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the rug out from under us as Mozilla has hired the founder and creator of the Macedon.Social
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server and basically the dictator for life as he feels he is now for the whole activity
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pub network that powers Macedon.Social and all the other servers that federate with
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his but now that Eugen has gone to the dark side I think many of us are going to look
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for other servers to where we can host our our emissives of of 142 characters or in the
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case of of Macedon 500 characters or less so the Macedon platform is a wonderful place
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for managing the community you can curate that community in any way you wish and you can
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ensure yourselves that people who share your values will find you there are more than a
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million monthly active users on a Macedon now and many more that are active less often.
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It's got more than 10 million subscribers I think now on all the various servers that are possible
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and it's even possible to host a server that doesn't share the general open source values.
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There are some really horrible Macedon servers out there and they can have their isolated communities
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without interference from us more optimistic hopeful open source proponents
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and there's a there's various hopeful and thoughtful opportunities that I'm discovering over on
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Macedon things like the tiny web there are I don't know if you remember the old web circle
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where you would have a red web ring they were called I guess where you would have just a circle
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of links where one site links to another and people put up their quite very focused blog posts
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or websites focused on one tiny little thing where they have something that they're passionate
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about and that's where human interaction is at its best when we focus on what we really
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care about instead of what we think others want to hear about from us when we're trying to make
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something popular when we're trying to make something that will make us money when we're trying to
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build influence rather than simply giving what we know that is when we start to chip away at our
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souls and we start to give away a bit of ourselves to the corporate algorithms and
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business world yeah we have to give up ourselves every now and then to sacrifice our
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well-being in order to support our employer or our lifestyle or just to just to live in the modern
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world we have to tow the line on a lot of things that don't align with our values but in our private
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lives that should not ever be the case we should not ever be forced to say something that we don't
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believe in passionate but just to build up a circle of friends and unfortunately that is the
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trap that most of the zombies out in the real world on Facebook and Twitter and Instagram and
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all the horrible social networks that are sucking people in with the tension hacking and
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outright exploitation and deception that is making life hell for most of us.
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A place ruled by the elite the elite who have gained influence by being sensational
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being saying things that are interesting and engaging I do not want to be engaged
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I just want to have a conversation I just with another authentic human being from the other
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end of the line and that's all I ask be authentic. As soon as I detect that anyone is trying to
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promote themselves or gain influence over me or try to shift my opinion in some way
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or pushing some propaganda or money-making scheme or trying to make even money for themselves
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I'm less likely to trust everything else that comes out of their mouth. I appreciate people who do
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things simply for the joy of it and that includes marketing even marketing for nonprofits.
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I've recently been involved in a very confrontational engagement and engagement is a word you
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typically use for warfare. When you're coming face to face with an enemy perhaps
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or even a user a user in the sense of a drug user someone that you want to get addicted to your
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product so that you can build on that insritification strategy that has made so many people so
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much money. Well I'm sure this rant has gone long enough for most of you so I've got to end on
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a positive note so night wise I really enjoy I really appreciate your name I as someone who suffers
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from insomnia as others on Hacker Public Radio do I can appreciate that name being wise at night
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that's when I feel many of my most thoughtful and wise ideas come to mind and a lot of it is
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because I listen to Hacker Public Radio in the night. Also I congratulate you on finding that
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getting and purchasing that nightwise.com URL for your blog post I'm sure you're an awesome
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marketer and a great asset to all of your employees but marketing is not what we need. I don't
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think at Hacker Public Radio I think what we need is community building and there are a lot of
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great resources and strategies around doing that and I will try to list some of them in the show
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notes with this podcast episode as long as well as links to Macedon servers and other resources
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that can help us grow. Well that does bring up one last idea that I have we picking up on your
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discord idea I think it would be a great idea to connect our comment section on the website to
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some social media platform but of course I would prefer that to be an open source and federated
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completely free of lock-in and free data free source code free everything and the only place I
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found that so far is with the activity pub protocol which is and there are several applications
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including Feddy Lab that I currently use on my my phone which connects to this what's generally
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called the Macedon social network so I will try to put resources there for how we could bridge
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and there are several bridges to Macedon even threads is a bridge from Facebook over to Macedon
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and there are bridges to Twitter and I'm sure we could being the the clever hacker crew that we are
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we could hack together a server that does a bridge from our website comments that or the RSS feed
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and sends it over to Macedon which by the way also provides you an RSS feed for all of your posts so
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it's open in all the right ways over on Macedon so let's let's put our heads together and let's
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come up with a let's have a conversation around how we can build this community at hacker public
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radio and make it a thriving future proof or as I prefer to say evergreen place let's make it green
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you have been listening to hacker public radio at hacker public radio does work today show was
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contributed by a hbrlisnet like yourself if you ever thought of recording podcast and click on
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our contribute link to find out how easy it leads hosting for hbr has been kindly provided by
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and onsthos.com, the internet archive and our sims.net on the satellite status today show is released
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under a creative commons attribution 4.0 international license
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