Episode: 1749
Title: HPR1749: Scale 13x Part 6 of 6
Source: https://hub.hackerpublicradio.org/ccdn.php?filename=/eps/hpr1749/hpr1749.mp3
Transcribed: 2025-10-18 08:47:10

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This in HPR episode 1,749 entitled, Kale-13X Part 6 on 6.
It is hosted by Lord Rush and Blood and in about 24 minutes long.
The summary is Justin King Browner Mace Emulated Computer.
This episode of HPR is brought to you by An Honesthost.com.
Get 15% discount on all shared hosting with the offer code HPR15.
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All right ladies and gentlemen of HPR Public Radio.
This is Lord Drockenblut here at scale 13X.
And who do I have the pleasure of speaking to you right now?
Hi, I am Justin King, I am 13 and I am one of the youngest speakers at scale if not
the youngest.
Now Justin what was your talk about?
My talk was about this emulator that I made of the oldest working digital computer that
is currently working, they rebooted it, but anyways I made an emulator about it and
it's for education and I'm talking about how my emulator helps with education and what
that 65 year old computer can teach us now.
Now what, what system did you create an emulator for?
It's called the witch, it's a real, it's the retro computer, it is in Bletchley Park in
England and it used decatrons which is a 10 digit, sorry, a 9 digit round.
Now let's get to some of the technical things here.
What language did you write your emulator in?
Well I wrote it in JavaScript and HTML and I did some CSS, however I used the framework
called enio, it's at eniojs.com if you don't know, to do all of the user interface.
Now so since you said HTML and jump, is this something that can run in your browser or
is this a desktop application?
It's a web browser application, it's best on Chrome or Chromium but it does work on
other browsers.
Now if I just happen to have the code that would have run on that machine, can I, or you
know, for say the application that, for that machine, could I run that application inside
of your system?
Yes, you actually can and that's the great thing about it.
It's an original computer put on to the web so basically anything you can run on the
witch, you can run on the witch, however it's not finished yet but it is almost complete
but it is live and you can check it out at witch.e.com dot org.
All right and what can people learn from a system that old this day and age?
First of all, keep it simple, stupid, aka kiss.
The principle that all programmers nowadays really need to learn which is keep it very
simple.
Don't over complicate things just because you think you need them, only get the bare minimum
and the fastest code.
Remember simple is fast code.
And what languages do you like to write in?
Well I like to do web languages mostly and I also do some Ruby, Python and I work in
several game engines like Unity 3D.
Now I'm assuming because we're sitting here at a, you know, primarily Linux and technology
conference, you're a Linux user yourself, how did you get started with Linux if I'm
not mistaken here and what is your preferred distro at this time?
Okay well how we got into Linux is because my dad uses Linux a lot, he has to use his
Mac for a lot of things but otherwise he does use Linux and his least favorite computer
to use.
He still has to use his work as Windows but anyways, I got into Linux when I first saw him
doing Linux and I have not had an actual Linux computer until recently, I've had to run
it in virtual machines and I have a Mac and I use it mainly because those virtual machines
are a bit of a pain but now that I have a Linux computer it's a Linux laptop, I use
it a lot now and it's mainly meant for gaming since it has a really good CPU, GPU and RAM
but overall I use it so much more.
So what is your current Linux system?
Oh sorry, my current Linux system is X subuntu which is Ubuntu with the XFCE desktop.
Well more what I meant and I'm sorry for phrasing it badly, what is your hardware?
Oh it's an old Windows notebook because it was originally my grandmother's but she decided
she didn't want it, it was too buggy so we decided to adopt it as our own and convert
it to Linux.
Very very nice.
What do you like about the Linux environment versus the OSX environment right now?
What I like better is mainly the more emphasis on the command line, mainly because the command
line is very nice and also just the interface in general is very nice and I also like how
it's one step closer to using wine since OSX has to go through X11 to wine.
There's one extra step in emulation and everything screws up.
So mainly it's because it's one step closer to the hardware and has better interface.
For someone as what a lot of people would perceive as young as you are, you have some really
strong opinions about things right now which is really refreshing to see, what are some
other strong opinions about technology you have right now that you think people should
know so they can understand you a little better.
First of all I hate Windows and more specifically I hate Windows because it's not a very good
operating system, it's mainly closed source and that Mac OSX is in the middle of open source
and also another reason I hate Windows is because the developers really could port all
these games to Linux or Mac, it's just they choose not to and I don't get it.
Another strong opinion I have is that Mac OSX is 10 times better than Windows and Linux
is 10 times better than Mac OSX but they're all good for their different areas.
So for example, Windows good for gaming, Linux good for developing and Mac good for business.
They all have their place and honestly I go with Windows and, sorry, not Windows, Linux
and Mac side.
That's rather an interesting take on things because I'd rarely heard OSX be claimed as the
one that's good for business.
I've actually heard it more, Windows is for business, OSX is for the artistic crowd, Windows
are for those crazy youngsters who love just tearing their systems apart and getting
to know every inner working of it.
So how is it you came to start with as for your personal laptop being Zabuntu over something
else?
Well, it was originally my dad's idea and I've already used Ubuntu but with Unity desktop.
So I decided well, XFC can't be any worse than Unity, I'm not saying Unity is bad at
all, I'm just saying it's not the most preferable above other desktop, so he decided to put
X Ubuntu on it.
I really didn't have any say, but I actually do like XFC, it works very well, it's very
fluid, it doesn't have too many transitions so it's not super slow.
The only problem is it actually does have a problem with lagging when it's connected
to a second display.
When it's what?
Connected to a second display.
So you have some issues doing dual monitor setups currently.
Yes, we've found that out during our presentation and especially Libre office has a problem
with that.
Libre office team, if you're listening please fix the bug that it basically shortens and
it leaves part of the presentation window open.
I'll explain more in detail.
Well actually I will tell you there is representation of the Libre office team.
At the conference in another part of the Expo Hall.
So you could go and talk to them, also you could try to file the bug with Libre office
letting them know this.
I know, but I just found it out today.
So definitely folks, we probably have perhaps one of our youngest bug submitters at least.
What are other things you like about the Linux environment right now?
Well those are the main things but another thing is of course free and open source software.
I love free software and I like it even more if it's open source mainly because I like
to help people out with projects and also I like to make it to where if I can't do
it something I can just compile it from source.
I've learned how to compile things from source pretty well and of course there's always
Mac ports or something other or apt to get packages if I don't know how to build them.
So that's one reason I like it.
Another reason I like Linux is because it is in so many different flavors.
Mac really know it's just one-sided windows it's even more one-sided but Linux you have
so many different things to try out and best of all they are all free.
Now you said you like it when it's free and when it's open let me ask you this.
Are you aware of as some people would say the difference between free software with the
capital F versus free software as in no cost?
No I'm not familiar with that but if I had to take my best guess then I would rather
have the one with the capital F because I would think that it would be actual free software.
Well and with the free as in capital F software that is the open source you're talking about.
I will tell you it can be among some parts of the community a rather contentious argument
as to the differences between free software and open source software.
Don't get bogged into the politics at this age kid.
Definitely.
All I think is that I honestly think free and open source software is better because anyone
can learn it and as I said in my presentation it can actually help people get jobs.
For example if you were working with NEOJS and helping out the project then you could
get redirected to LG and they could say we like you and you could get a job.
Now 13 years old you're still in school.
I've heard you know in some schools it can be problematic trying to use things that aren't
you know the close source software because the school dictates you have to have this
that or the other.
Have you run into these kind of issues with school at all at this point?
Yes I have but it's not that much of a problem since it is still free software and I don't
really have to contribute it to it.
They require we use Google Docs instead of LibreOffice but honestly I don't care since
it's not something I really could contribute to Google wouldn't make it open source and
best of all Google makes it to where they actually listen to your opinions and that's
one great thing about open source that Google actually does.
Well Google is definitely a huge consumer of free and open source software.
No doubts about that.
How is it and you know most kids are age and I can remember now granted you know there
is 30 some years difference between Justin and my age here you know my time when I was
you know around 13 years old last thing I wanted to do was the indoors that was you
know outside jamming away on you know any excuse to be away from anything that could be
associated with learning.
How is it you have ended up with such a voracious appetite for technology?
Well it was mainly because of my early background so when I was four I went into kindergarten
that was pretty early and also Jen Greenaway did a talk on this at scale 11x but if you
read earlier you're more likely to program better.
So I was reading when I was two and a half not reading completely but I was reading a lot
when I was two and a half and that probably contributed to it.
So then I grow up I go to Vihavali school in Santa Barbara and I finally learn programming
using a logo programming language and I wasn't I was okay with it but then the next
year in first grade that is when I started to become a prodigy at programming and you
can only imagine how that just wanted me to learn more.
I also do 3D rendering and animation and game design not just programming but overall
I'm pretty well rounded in the area of technology.
Awesome now what are some technologies or you know things within the Linux and free and open
source community that you're looking forward to start playing with more.
Well mainly the blender game engine I've done a lot with blender 3d but blender game engine I
really want to see and that's one of the major ones I'm not really sure about anything else
but maybe I'd like to get into open shot unfortunately I have after effects on my Mac so
it's a lot better than open shot at this state but I hope that open shot will step up their game
and add lots more special effects.
Well perhaps with as advanced as you are right now perhaps maybe you can start contributing
to projects like open shot shot cut and some of the other videos out there maybe you can help
bring those improvements you want to see to these projects instead of just waiting for someone
else to do it. I mean you've already brought in the emulator to market that no one else has.
I definitely agree but then again I'm pretty busy with school and I try to help whenever I
can but then again I have to learn a whole new programming language I don't know what open shot
is written in but I know for sure that it is not JavaScript and HTML so I'd have to learn a whole
new programming language I'm completely open to that but I don't know if I have time but if I do
have time then I would be sure to do that. Well Justin at this point is there anything else
do you would like the hacker public radio audience to know anything you think I've missed that you
would like to talk about. Yes first of all as I said in my talk um which is at um google slides
I basically want people to share the witch dash e the witch dash e is available at which
dash e the witch that flies on the broom w i t c h dash e dot or g and you can look at the manual
but what I really want people to do is I want people to share this with any school you can try to
implement it in your school if you can't make it a class make it a club but I just want people to
spread this overall and help all these kids to become programmers so that the lack of programmers
disappears. All right and one thing I was asked um specifically to ask people is what is your
preferred text editor um oh that's a difficult one um I use text editor I mainly use the graphical
ones mainly because I don't know how to do vi yet however I am learning vi and I usually do
insert mode when I use vi so that's really not that's really cheating so I usually use g
edit and text edit but I do use vi sometimes. All right um and actually because we have one other
person sitting right behind you um let's see if we could sneak her into the conversation for a moment
and who are you ma'am and what is your relation to Justin? My name is Marina King and I'm his mother.
Marina you know your son here seems to be a definitely step ahead of the rest of most kids his age.
What are your thoughts on that and you know how did you kind of help foster this?
Um I just support his interest support the things that he likes to do um help him uh stay organized so
that he can take advantage of his opportunities that's about it. Um and is there anything you would
like the hacker public radio audience um to know maybe ways that parents who have young kids up
and coming right now ways they could help foster their son or daughter um with an interest
in love for science and technology. Just um look at different opportunities um anything from summer
camps to things that the school has to offer or if the child is able to get into the gate program
or honors that definitely helps um let me um gate program isn't something I'm aware of is this
a regional thing or is this a wider organization? Gate just stands for gifted and talented
education so it's it's just a program in the elementary schools and in some secondary schools
where and it's it's all over you know at least all over California probably around the nation um it's
just a program that accelerates helps to accelerate it's it's like an like honors classes helps
kids to um have enrichment classes or move ahead and especially in math and science um in the the
PTA the parent teacher organizations there's also the STEM classes science technology
um engineering and math and so they can look out for opportunities with um without and just just
look just keep your eye out for various opportunities or um also Khan Academy has some good opportunities
online some free educational opportunities just try to keep them you know motivated or have them
come do an event like scale all right so I would love to thank you both for your time I know
things are getting a little late here in the evening here at scale 13x um Justin I'm sure I
could speak for the entire hacker public radio audience we we invite you to become a part of
our community we would love to see you contribute however you can on creating audio content to share
talking about things um and we look forward to the bright future I believe you have
in the Linux and um broader free and open source software communities so this has been Lord
John Blute here at scale 13x with Justin King thanking everyone for their time
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