hpr-knowledge-base/hpr_transcripts/hpr4131.txt

Episode: 4131
Title: HPR4131: HPR Community News for May 2024
Source: https://hub.hackerpublicradio.org/ccdn.php?filename=/eps/hpr4131/hpr4131.mp3
Transcribed: 2025-10-25 20:04:01

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This is Hacker Public Radio Episode 4131 from Monday the 3rd of June 2024.
Today's show is entitled HPR Community News from May 2024.
It is part of the series HPR Community News.
It is hosted by HPR volunteers and is about 109 minutes long.
It carries an explicit flag.
The summary is, HPR volunteers talk about shows released and comments posted in May 2024.
Hi everybody, this is Ken.
Just before this episode, I get a bit annoyed and I use some fairly rough words about people who did us
the internet archive at the end, so you might want to put on a bleep filter or put in headphones if you've got
kids in the back of the car.
All right, just to back relax and enjoy the show here is the Community News.
Hi everybody, my name is Ken Fallon and you're listening to another episode of Hacker Public Radio.
This is the Community News from May 2024.
Joining me today is...
Hi, it's Dave Morris in Edinburgh.
And I am in sunny Netherlands at an altitude of minus two meters at the moment.
Yeah, I'm not really up the mountain, but the side of the hill, but only a little hill.
We're on the... what was the previous coastline here before the ice and before the
reddened ice and mirror built up here and all that stuff.
Hey guys, so I'm in the basement, so minus two done.
Anyway, more information than the Community News but you know, just painting a picture for everybody.
This is Hacker Public Radio, Hacker Public Radio.
Is a suppose you could call us Hacker Space that releases podcasts or adventures.
How close would that be, Dave?
And are never ending journey to try and find some way of destroying this in another video clip?
It's an impossible task, but that's certainly a way of looking at it.
There is a bunch of people who share ideas and views and solutions and stuff and chat to some extent.
And yeah, and we'll join together to listen to things and have similarities, yes.
Yeah, I've been really thinking about this month especially, but we'll go through the shows.
And the reason we're doing that is this is the Community News Show series.
We have series on HPR and you can contribute to a series or start a new series.
Sometimes it's got three or more episodes available at the time of creation.
And we are the janitors on HPR.
You should go to the about page to see how the community is is built and maintained.
And we make sure that at least once a month,
you get an opportunity to hear some positive feedback on your episode.
Okay, that explanation wasn't that great, but stick along to the end of the show and you kind of get the idea.
For the first time we hang in is introduce new hosts and that is your role.
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Yes, I'm poised waiting to tell everybody about the fact we have one new host this month,
which is wonderful and it is Moss Bliss, who many of us know.
So he's a podcaster in other contexts and has I think he's chatted on new year shows,
depth people quite a lot, but this is really his first real full blown show.
So yeah, very welcome indeed.
I know the one of these hosts that I could not believe was a first time host,
because sometimes when we get the episode in, it says host zero, so host zero is default.
And you go and that's because somebody's changed their email address and then we need to communicate with people and say,
do you want to keep the old one or the new one or what do you want to do?
And because you know, you don't want 15 different accounts or the same thing.
Well, no, I look back, it was the first time Moss had done the show himself.
I've just heard him.
He's so much part of the Linux freely open source podcasting community that's just taken for granted that he's done the show.
Yeah, me too.
Yes, yes, so very good to hear him and obviously we'll be hearing his first show later on as we go through the shows.
So prompting prompting the inevitable.
Let's do that then. Let's go through the show's day starting with the old classic what's in my bag.
And this is our typical introductory app as well.
Actually, your introductory episode should be high.
My name is Blan. Here's my history and here I got how I got to HPR.
And then your second show is what's in my mind.
So you're daily stuff that you rely on, daily tech that you use, that sort of.
Yes, yes, it's so it's good insight into what people do and what they consider is important in in their daily lives and stuff.
So they're always like always good things to hear. So yeah.
So that was a nice refresher episode.
I think they have done previous episodes with the other end of past.
So this was enough to back exchange contents change.
So yeah, it's in a program.
I was thinking of doing an updated episode on the one that I did was I actually carry a lot less stuff now.
I just don't want that up and that's it.
Yeah, yeah, I think we will do that.
Don't we?
Let's your plumber or an engineer or something.
Yeah, cool.
And the following day we had an episode from Nightwise who talked about some changes.
Headspear could embrace to become future proof.
Do you want to do the first comment?
Yep.
So first comment was from Dirk who says the future about HBO.
Hi there.
Nice to hear about take you a little stroll through the vineyards for us.
The vein carnivores, which is a forest located on a hill behind my house.
I don't remember that sentence.
Living in old hersalt, it's in my backyard, smiley face.
Good points about the future of HBO.
As a geek, a long time listener and fan, for me, recording a show as a response is just one step too much or too high as well.
Next time we can go together for a walk at Napoleon's.
Is that a wind, wind garden boss?
Wind garden boss.
Wind garden boss.
Of course, yes, because of vine garden will be a vineyard, won't it?
And boss will be for it.
Yes, yes, got it, got it, got it.
Thanks to the HBO episode, many greetings from a fellow geek from out Hoysalt.
Dirk.
Very good.
To which I replied, thanks for volunteering.
This grace show, thanks for looking into this from a business point of view.
You're correct in saying that the website could be with a lot of plays.
Given our booth kit needs a revamp, this could be a great time for refresh.
So anyone with design skills, please step forward to help.
And that I am talking to the listener community of HBO.
This was in the comment stepping aside.
If there's anybody with design tips, you were not expecting you to implement it.
Technically, you don't need to do anything.
All you need to do is find some free liberal open source.
So creative commons under a new license under an open license of some sort.
CSS or designs that you feel that would look good on our website.
So we were just talking before the show, Dave and I,
that what we really needed is something that when you go to the main HBO website,
it's in your face who we are, what we do and why you need contribute.
That those boom straight in your face and then the episodes.
Yeah.
So back to the comment.
And I'm addressing some of the points that night wise made in the episode specifically.
So one was the intro and outro are specifically chosen to be calming to meet the community requirements
that the music should not wake up people who listen to podcasts when going to sleep.
And this was discussed in 2021 in October.
Next point.
I'm not sure how you fall into the mistake and belief that we only have an IRC channel.
And that we don't engage with the community and that we avoid corporate technology.
On every photo of every page on the site is a list of social media outlets we are active on.
We actively engage on the mailing list master done matrix,
mumble, IRC, our cast plan is X, formerly Twitter, Facebook and LinkedIn.
Soon to be added will be telegram, which you've already done.
Thanks, Dave.
Yep.
And YouTube channels.
So the actual answer to is why don't we have a distort in the answer to that is because nobody has volunteered to do it.
Until now.
So if you're willing to set it up and manage that feel free to do so, send us the link and we'll happily add it to the site.
Can you do the next two while I just see a pop up and do something? I will be listening.
So night wise comments.
I don't know how I'm pronouncing other pronunciations right.
All total calling.
Smiley face.
It only takes a geeky podcast to find out that we live so close by.
Smiley face.
Imagine that.
Give me a ping via mail or something and we could meet up.
Second one from night wise.
Hack a public radio as brown noise.
Question mark.
Hey Ken.
Thank you for the positive feedback on our show.
We're indeed present on X, Twitter, Facebook and YouTube.
But are we active there?
Do we engage with the community there?
I appreciate all the work that is being done.
Don't get me wrong up.
Also more than happy to help run the discord server if we can actively promote it in the shows.
The one statement that as a marketer did make me choke on my coffee is that as the intro now true,
that should be soothing for people who want to fall asleep to the show.
We cannot in all seriousness state that content provided by a host is to be packaged up into some
narcoleptic brown noise generator.
Is this the message we want to send out?
Tell us what you're working on but not too loud.
We want to doze off to your content.
The goal for me in contributing a show is to invigorate, inspire and motivate fellow geeks to try out new things.
Discover new technologies and share experiences.
Not to record a high tech guided sleep meditation.
I think that in this regard we are misguidedly catering to a minute part of our community and should reconsider our approach on these matters.
Okay.
Yes, Empardo says interesting episode.
I quite enjoy listening to the episode of HBR very well articulations.
Seems to me the main argument can be summarized as HBR should be chasing popularity.
This may very well be optimal thing to do however when I look around at those that do so,
which admittedly is a small sample size and not random.
And may also suffer from survivor bias.
I see results that are rather unpleasant well to me.
Clearly there are many who must enjoy those high ranking YouTube tech channels for example.
Success can be measured in many ways.
Popularity is indeed one of those measures.
There is an episode all the same but count me out.
And Estello says the future of HBR.
Great show. Many thanks for sharing with what little understanding of social media has spelt in a funny way.
I believe what is currently effective is active engagement with the wider community than what already exists.
That means indeed going where a potential audience might be and shouting about HBR.
TikTok, YouTube, Snapchat, where the kids hang out as well as discord as you rightly point out.
Given limited resources perhaps we should drop LinkedIn and Facebook in favour of one or more of those more zippy platforms.
Ken already has plans for YouTube I see.
Well anyone with a few minutes could post episodes to those channels.
See how down with the lingo I am.
I think that automating the process would be a good starting point.
That's beyond my skill set but I would bet that there are some listeners who could manage to knock something together.
As a community podcast it's a community pot responsibility.
Again out there and engage actively where we can bring in new listeners and therefore contributors.
Such is the reality of the internet in 2024 sadly.
And then I'll do the next two because I posted a response.
Just on that last two or three episodes, two or three comments there.
I will be doing a full follow up episode to the feedback on this show.
On another one that's coming up and on another two that's coming up so.
I'll go into more detailed excruciating detail later as to what we've done but I'll just read the feedback.
Now here.
Active for a given value of active is my comment and I'm responding to.
Thank you for the positive feedback on the show.
Are we present on X Facebook Twitter or are we active there?
And that was from Nitroids who said that.
So yes, we spend easily 90% of our time working on community engagement in some form or another.
I would conservatively say that I have invested thousands of hours into it over the years.
Each community requires a tailored approach because it is not really realistic to expect the same approach on LinkedIn to work on TikTok.
Therefore we actively engage at the level and the extent that is appropriate for a given platform as dictated by the terms and conditions.
The behavioral norms and operating rules of the community is there while keeping in mind the return of investment each platform delivers.
Who is marketing statement?
Anyway, the fact of the matter is that some channels do not lend themselves to providing contributions.
For example, Facebook and LinkedIn have zero engagement.
The feedback I get from the people I have tried to engage with on LinkedIn is that they don't want to know.
They don't want their employer to know that they're associated with a project with the word hacker in that study.
While several Facebook groups responded to my request with one line link to some of the more unsurvy issues that we have hosted.
We have maintained the presence as an avenue for contact on these platforms.
We have been on Twitter since 2008 and we have more than 10,000 posts and we have 1,919 followers.
To this day we comment and respond on every show and actively follow up on engagement to my knowledge and people please send in shows telling us how you found HPR.
That would be great or a comment to this episode at least.
To this day, we have not got a single new host via Twitter.
Quite a few people that our hosts have followed us over there but not the new host via Twitter itself.
Community building takes a lot of time and it can take years before you see the results of your work.
Please don't just start up an account I'm talking about discord on a service if you're not willing to maintain it for the long run.
It's one thing to have a presence on these platforms.
It's another thing to have a defunct inactive presence.
By far the best way of engagement is talking to people about HPR.
Asking them to contribute is applies to other interactions but it is especially true of in-person context.
I go on in another comment.
Regarding proprietary platforms, we do not have the luxury of restricting ourselves based on whether a platform is proprietary software or not.
We go where the potential contributors are.
One could be forgiven for looking at the software choices that we use and getting engagement on that we are biased towards plus platforms.
But what you're seeing is the effect and not the cause.
Starting out our policy was to use existing platforms as much as possible.
We were not afraid to use and pay for proprietary software.
However, in the nearly 19 years of operation we saw the companies come and go and with proprietary software you left high on dry why with plus or software you can find somewhere else to host it.
Your show focused on the IRC channel and while that's true we did have a thriving community there for a while that stopped when free node got taken over.
We do maintain presence on IRC but most people have moved to matrix where the contributions and feedback has been very good.
But again, I'm not sure it's new people, it's existing hosts who wish to discuss stuff and ask people if they're interested.
That's about it.
You're suggesting possibly ironic of replacing IRC with a bulletin board system and this is something that you random guys mentioned as well.
I want to talk about that. So from 2005 each show was automatically posted for discussion on a bulletin board system.
It was been read.
Unfortunately, that community was abandoned when the corporation producing the software stopped support.
It was shut down after it was compromised and the entire site I got an overrun with spam.
In the common system is on HPR. It was a third party application running on C panel.
The corporation producing the commenting system stopped support and after it was compromised the site got overrun with spam.
For a time the entire HPR domain was blocked as a spam site and Dave and I were able to salvage the database and we put in some robust checks into the code that is now released under the AGPL V3.
Since then control panel itself, the price is so much that to such an extent that we had to migrate to static sites, which is now also available on the AGPL.
But we were able to just move mailman our mailman mailing list to another operator and that's a service that I pay for.
So in 2011 we jumped on the Google post bandwagon and we got a lot of contributions until it was shut down in 2019.
So that's the commons so far on that.
Okay.
This one's going to run and run.
It's as I was saying to you beforehand, I'm really glad that might wise did the show.
It's always a bit interesting when you get a show that you know is going to be about the project that you're working on yourself.
And of course the rules that we have is we don't monitor the show beforehand except for spam checking purposes.
So we're trying to get this through so it goes to the future feed so you can hear about it, but it was a.
And I think the community HBR now is and this is some topics I would discuss later HBR now is not the HBR that maybe was, you know, 15 years ago when it started, but it shouldn't be because it's a different time different people have come different people have done.
I like to think that the core values that we have remain the same what they are should be on the website.
So we do need somebody to help out on the website.
So there's lots of food for thought in there and I'm not really ready yet to do the feedback on all these episodes.
It really has made me focus on.
It is to find the problem true true true thinking hold on that can't be right nor fence noise.
That can't be right. Then it has made me think about, you know, but if that's not right, then why isn't it right and it's hopefully be able to put some meat on flesh and wants.
That's not to say I don't disagree with I just I actually don't disagree with the nightwise, but it's important that people realize that the website is changing the whole time.
The community is changing the whole time the amount of shows that there are are changing the whole time.
If you happen to come to HBR and one month is just everything is about is about widgets.
And you you're left with the feeling that, you know, all anybody ever talks about an HBR is widgets.
Well, you know, come back next month and we'll be talking about food bar and you know, so it's it's.
I'm very done.
So you don't form your opinions just based on.
You need to subscribe and delete that's the that's the key people say they like it, particularly because it is so varied.
You know, so that's that's one of its strengths, I believe.
Yeah, but that could also be self filtering.
You know, somebody might want their the same stuff rehashed and sent out to them every day, but that's not what HBR is where something else.
So we can be different. It's okay.
Okay, next day we had playing civilization number three, part two by a hookah where we learn how to dine formally in a.
For some reason, when I was reading that there, I was thinking like a 18th century are.
Yeah, 18th century thing for you're giving a big bowl and eating as a dinner with the king or something.
But that is not what the game was about.
Very disappointed, I was okay expecting to guess.
Finally a show about which fork to use as a formal dinner, but not just turned out to be a game of attacking.
It's it's it's a weird thing though is civilization is quite fascinating to hear it through a hookah's reports about it.
But it's not.
It's it's quite complicated, but it's quite quite neat the way that you set it up.
I thought that was.
I came away thinking I could I could probably play that, but I don't know with row over.
It was quite quite good time to description.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't have the time.
My time seems to be getting shorter and shorter these days, so I can't really dedicate to the amount of time you'd need.
That's everything.
That's just because I'm asking you to do more and more stuff today.
So it is, yes, it's all your fault.
Yep.
Yeah, and last show, the next show we had didn't have any comments because we said nothing controversial.
So yeah, there you go.
Shall we shall we get through this show without sending anything controversial to him?
Who knows, yes, I can't define controversial.
It's the audience has to do that.
We try our best.
The next show was Jason and vendors and all of my, oh, I do feel operators pain.
But the answer operator is JQ.
The answer to any question related to Jason is JQ.
He was struggling with specific use case for somebody who works in the security industry.
I guess will be the best way to describe it.
But if you're messing with Jason files, JQ will tell you the line, the exact line that's just going wrong out.
So it's fantastic to answer is JQ.
Let me, you do the next show then.
Yes, today I learned is the next show from Scotty, some guy on the internet.
And he's talking about things he's learned about said, said something.
And I have a vested interest in it, which he kindly referred to since I did the series on said some many, many years ago.
And he's, he's using it to do some quite cool things in some scripts.
Is it more than one script? Yeah, it's, yeah.
It's, it's a lot in there.
It's a huge lot in there.
Well, it's well worth looking through it and understanding it.
And he does, he does explain it at a level that, hopefully, is.
Yeah, no, that's fine.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So it's, do you hear that beep then?
I do. I do. Yes.
Not just in my head. No, that is not this time.
So I'm not having the delusion.
No, that is the sand that somebody sent in a comment, which I try not to share.
But I can't seem to switch it off without dismantling stuff.
That was actually me sending in the comments.
I knew it. Anyway, yes.
So, yeah, it's great.
Sorry, sorry.
Let's just take a moment here, guys, to realize what's just happened.
There is somebody in the HBO community that is a voluntary community doing stuff on a totally voluntary basis, right?
Who has got a fecking alarm going off every time that you send a comment, right?
Just sit back and think about that.
The level of dedication that you have to a project, if that happens.
Insanity might be the other word to you.
Dedication.
That's all the dedication.
That is fucking awesome.
Okay.
That's a phone noise grabbed off.
What's that open sound site that you can, you can download.
So it's an American dial-up beta bone thingy from the old days.
I think it follows on to the song, the telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
It might be that one I got over that.
That means anything to anybody, I don't know.
Yeah, so thanks.
It's great to hear you.
For this, it's fun.
It's good.
Yeah.
And again, the show where Starredolf gone, what is he doing?
Why is he doing this?
And then he ended up gone.
Maybe I should be doing this.
It's a good test.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I've done these sorts of episodes with scripts in.
Don't tend to do them so much these days.
But I've actually then chopped the script up and put lots of written stuff around it.
But when I used to do extremely long show notes as a separate file,
I have no idea if that was ever of any of you.
But it just seemed like the right thing to do at the time.
So I think it's an interesting subject to debate about how,
if you want to present a script of the world, how you do it.
This is certainly fascinating, quite interesting to see how Scotty does what he does.
And he also alerted me to things that I have forgotten.
I've been using Find now for, I don't know, 20 plus years or something.
And it always had to have a backslash semicolon on the end.
Plus semicolon, which he has in his script here, is a perfectly valid thing to do.
And it gives a different effect, which I don't actually remember at the moment.
Yeah, so it's always good to look at these things if you're interested in the subject
because you learn things, because from things that people have other aspects
that people will find about them.
And you know, you can learn even if you think you know it all.
I don't think I know it all, but I think I know a moderate amount.
But yeah, so excellent, excellent stuff.
Thank you very much for that.
As we were speaking there, note to the community as well.
I'm looking for somebody who has experience with managing files outside of Git or as part of Git.
So we have lots of that sort of show notes that are not in Git,
but are on the web server and should be included in the tracking as part of the show.
So somebody give me some of the installs on that would be very useful.
Something like Artifactory or something along those lines.
Or if you've got something else listener, get in touch.
Just making notes here on my responsive.
So introducing JQ part.
Yeah, thank you Dave for this.
Yep, yep, yep.
It's slow but slow and steady.
Not done much about JQ part three yet because it's been too busy with other things.
Yeah, but hopefully it will be there soon.
And hopefully it's helpful to anybody who works in recent work.
No, it's useful.
I'm going to be linking this on our internal work.
How to page once it becomes a series.
Yep, which is next next show next show.
Nobody cares.
Obviously about JQ because there's no comments.
What?
What?
What?
What?
Story of my life, mate.
Story of my life.
Tagging music with beats and Kady Murray says just what the doctor ordered.
Oh, show was about.
Yeah, by D&T.
I was just starting to poke around with tools to deal with the back leg of old music.
I recovered from an ancient hard drive in the parents' basement.
They should do the job nicely, particularly since it has the built-in music brains integration.
Thanks.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It was very interesting.
I don't know anything about this.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
It was interesting.
I don't know anything about this.
It's all-
I've done this with easy tag, but I don't know whether easy tag is pulling off support or
I've not used it for years and years.
But, yeah, but this sounds really good.
So on my list, as well, I'm currently now, again, archiving the Señor tips.
That's okay.
We'll continue on.
I've learn some stuff.
There are show's in the making.
God, I'm owing myself three shows here since we started.
Anyway, oh, yes.
Yes, yes, yes.
We have hubs with his response to show 4109, which was...
which was...
Nice was the show.
And that's just dig into it in the show he was talking about stuff.
So let's just...
Nice was just a small correction.
Thank you very much.
I appreciate you taking the time to respond.
But do need to clarify some points.
The first classic mistake of people confuse marketing and sales.
Marketing is about finding value proposition behind a certain product
and finding the right audience who would benefit from us.
No, it's not about pushing a product or selling ads.
It's about telling the story of free software, small web, open source.
What have you?
To people who don't know about it and would benefit getting to know about it.
At no point in time did I say it was chasing popularity controversy or propaganda.
At no point did I say we would need to monetize HPR.
I am saying that we need to speak about the value of HPR.
To people who benefit from us and give everyone a simple way to interact
to further engage in the value of building community.
And actually that is what I took from the episode.
So not to be assured that that is exactly what.
And that's a big thing.
That right there.
HPR is different things to different people.
So yeah.
Okay.
Your comparison to a marketer with a drug dealer to me feels a little naive and quite offensive.
Stallone markets free software.
Remember too.
Yeah.
Okay.
I think we're all a little bit guilty of marketeers and lawyers and stuff.
More than no jokes.
Let's not do that.
There are different types of marketeers as part of the issue.
Exactly.
Some of them are doing a very valiant job.
Pymoroni sends me messages saying, we've got a new thingy for your rusty pipe.
And I go, yay.
And I run them by it.
But I also get told about socks and mattresses and other rubbish that I'm never ever ever going to buy.
But I'm told about, I mean, it's ads.
But you know, I'm not sure we're ads marketing.
And again, the other, yeah, exactly.
And that speaks to, that speaks to the, to the main question, which I'll deal with in the show.
Because if I keep talking, Dave, then you've got to get the show.
And then we'll be down the show, which is a preview of what the show will be about it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Anyway, next comment.
Katie Murray says, okay, but people can skip episodes they don't enjoy.
We don't have to limit the ordinance to semi-retired geeks.
Many of those who fought to the small web and silvery add on to their other more mainstream tools,
take it from one such zombie marketing strategies don't buy the nature solely anything.
They simply make things easier for a target audience to find.
It's up to our community to deploy them sensibly.
Discord works just fine on Linux.
I use it daily.
There's a big difference between trying to attract some fresh ears,
and a splinter group trying to win the day in quotes.
Maybe evolution isn't what the community wants.
In which case, I'm happy to let it continue on its way and meet whatever fate awaits it.
Yes.
No, no, no, no.
I put a good point.
And a good, you know, a good scientist to check there.
Response next from me is actual actions.
Hi, Hobbs and Nightwives.
I think you both say that you both say to have meaningful conversation.
Apparently, I lost all sense of grammar.
Yeah, yeah, happened to happen.
Oh, I'm missing a common narrative.
I think you both say that we should be having a meaningful conversation with community,
but each have your own preferred way of doing this.
That's fine.
What I'm missing is clear statements of actions.
HPR can do to increase the number of shows and the number of holes.
If you say the website needs improving, then at a minimum provide examples of hot needs improving.
Better point us to style sheets that we can use to fix your points.
And when you talk about common system needs work, tell us what work is needed
so that we can see if it's intended to be like that for anti spam or avoiding flamers
or if it can be improved.
And don't forget that the janitors just do what they're told.
And the owners are the community members.
So some things have already been agreed on the main list.
To change that, you, not the janitors, will need to argue your point and convince them so.
Looking forward to very constructive shows that will focus on these goals can keeper of the broom.
I've updated myself.
I have keeper of the broom.
Is that one with this handle on it?
I was wondering where that went, Dave.
I got that from my grandfather.
I only have to change the handle four times in the head eight times.
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
I need to remember what was going to say.
Yeah, I need to make notes about the commenting system.
Actually, I need to go through all of these.
Oh, yeah. Copyright.
Copyright assignment.
Yeah, it's not just like that.
No, it's from my future episode because there's suggestions of putting the count
well, and we'll get to it.
No, we won't get it here because I spoke to noise wise and hubs about about this on a mail.
And they have additional points, which I will address in my response show.
But we have we have the thing about our stuff can go somewhere else because we know the license that is under.
And the common system can go somewhere else doing is the common system released under Creative Commons.
We should share a lot.
Yes, it kind of is because we say everything on the website is about.
Do we make it explicit?
How do we track down everybody who's ever commented?
Yeah, given that we don't ask.
Thank you for the hell they want to be.
Anyway, and we're also releasing log files after a week now.
Because we don't need them.
We have the stats on the HBO or on the internet archive.
And yeah, so.
And that wasn't a design in my part.
It's just.
They got deleted.
So yeah.
Anyway, where are we?
Low hanging fruit.
Do you want to do night?
Yep.
Nightwise says low hanging fruit.
Hey, Ken.
I've been listening.
I've been thinking about some low hanging fruit we can pick.
Get some extra traction.
Number one, real time community interaction set up a discord server for HBO community members and listeners.
With the challenges closet channel for operational management stuff.
But two, social media presence.
I don't think we should be on every social media channel.
Just the ones where our community and target audience is.
So keeping in the spirit of freedom.
We might want to focus on mastered on and if possible a link with threads.
I think we already have an automated RSS feed that posts links to all new shows on Twitter and Facebook.
But getting traction on your social media presence is easier if you choose up your engagement.
Number three, promotion of these channels in the Bumper Struck trailers of the shows to pull in listeners into engaging with the community.
This way we can encourage them to record their own show.
Number four, talk about HBO or non-HPR podcasts.
Do we ever have hosts that are guests on other podcasts?
Talking about podcasts, anyone can join.
It's a great topic for other podcasts too.
Five, record YouTube tutorial on how to record and upload a show.
Signet somewhere that is immediately obvious that under URL,
www.hackampoverly.org slash, how to record.
As for redesigning the website, we should take a look at how the pages are built and organized to make it easier to attract new listeners.
It makes it more obvious that they can contribute to.
Intr goldm Slowly void over you know how I feel about it.
It's long-winded slow and well.
It's built to help.
You can't be late to rest covered with soil and flowers and replaced by something shorter
and snappier.
I'm more than happy to help if you need a new voiceover.
I've got my money where my mouth is, here's the HPR Discord, it gives a link, these
some steps in the right direction.
So there is the HPR Discord, so I don't have Discord, I never used it just to use it.
I've used it once when we, I think they were setting up an on-camp, maybe the Manchester
last Manchester one and people were going to chat on Discord, but it actually proved
to be quite unpopular, I think, that there were some people who wore on it and some,
the rest all moved over to Telegram, I think, I don't remember what it was.
That's why there's an on-camp Telegram channel, I think, but yeah, so, but I've not used
it.
Except for those few minutes and then I said, yeah, I don't want that, I've got enough
already.
Yeah, the thing is, which is which, and do you remember that thing back in the day where
we got bothered by a fellow pubcaster about a vile and vitriol that was on our IRC server?
Remember that?
No, I do, Dave, because it's something that we don't, I didn't experience, but the
was, there was apparently all sorts of nastiness going on on the IRC channel, and at the time,
the person who met the statements didn't engage with us, but since then, I realized that
it could very well have been the IRC channel on another server that has since been shut
down, that I only found out about years after, and yeah, it wouldn't surprise me if that
was, in fact, the case.
So that also brings up something, what's official?
Yes, yes.
So if the janitors are not on there, you know, doing the janitor thing, then there's an official
server. If whoever's on there is going to be official, then the same rules apply to them
as applied to us, which is two years of support, making sure you get a team, passing it onto
somebody else before you move on, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, because we don't have
the time.
We literally, I literally do not have any more time to spend on HDR.
In fact, I'm getting told I'm spending too much time on HDR, particularly when this
has gone on, when there's activity in the community as such, then it becomes a lot, a lot
busier all of a sudden.
So yeah, so who's going to be making sure that we set the tone of open engagement yet at
the same time?
You know, the whole, we know it when we see it sort of track behavior, you can use root
words, but only if they're appropriate, and only, you know, that's the whole sort of
thing.
Well, I know the conduct doesn't exist, but we do have a call to conduct really, and that's
something that needs to be put on the website.
The fact that we don't have a call to conduct doesn't mean we don't expect a call to conduct,
you know, JWP's granny is a, you know, classic example, call the conduct using, using
bad language like I did in this episode, without putting a warning at the beginning, that
would be something.
Yeah, but it needs to be pleased to manage in some way.
Well, not pleased to such, but yeah, if there's all sorts of hate speech going on in there,
then it reflects badly on HGIR as a community.
And then we can say, well, that is nothing to do with us, you know, only the officials.
And then it goes, all the link on your website to this page.
So if it's on the page, then I feel an honest to be maintaining it, and I don't want to
be maintaining the discord server.
So the person who's doing that needs to be in there every day, making sure, doing what
we do on the other sites.
So every day, if anything happens on LinkedIn or Facebook, I get an email and I need to
log in and check every day, I'm on Twitter, Mastodom, La, you're on the telegram the whole
time.
So, yeah.
And we're on, I'm mostly in matrix, every day I'm on matrix, I'm on matrix, all the time,
yeah.
There is a HPR matrix channel, and we also have the juniors hit your channel and the
juniors, the losers, which, yeah, which actually noticed, and the Katie Murray, who were
joining because they were doing some work on the website tickets, so we tried them in
to give them, you know, it's just easier and faster, if we do it in the chat, or other
than comments on the, on the tickets.
Sometimes, anyway, who's, who's, who's, who's, who's, who's, who's, who's, who's,
I guess I just did the night white one, didn't I?
Yeah.
Yes, mustard on comments.
I've been experiencing, experimenting with methods to include mustard on thread as
comments in static pages.
I'm thinking we can include replies to the HPR bot, some space, which is our HPR.
And it's not, it's a HPR bot, but I am manually in there all the time as well posting,
So it just happens to be a boss, but it ain't a boss.
As an additional way to comment on the show,
I'll do a show about a few different ways
to include master and comments.
Please do, only a show.
And more method I'm looking at using
is master and API to pull replies, therefore,
allowing an opportunity to gaze what comments appear
on a web page.
Very interesting, because Casper and Karis,
the cartoon series, I'm not peppering Karis.
Peppering Karis.
Peppering Karis.
Peppering Karis.
He has replaced his comment system.
I saw a blog post going, what, that was the last time
he was going to use commenting system,
and I was feeling it's been given what we went through
with the commenting system.
And he then got help from the community,
and there's a full write-up on how to integrate master
and non-comments into the HDR site.
So technically, it's something that we could do.
It's something we didn't do, because we didn't have
the infrastructure in place to be able to do it.
But now we do.
And furthermore, the only thing that's left
is the licensing aspect.
But we have to deal with that.
Anyway, let's come on open.
Another thing.
Okay, that was that from that.
Tune in tomorrow.
No, we're not even halfway, folks.
Go take a rest break, and then we'll come back to this.
All right.
The next day, anything else to say on that day?
No.
Well, there's tons to say, but now it's not the time.
Yeah.
4114117.
Jamboree, GABA application Magicberg Operation Root
emulator easy.
This is the operator.
This is the show where I completely understand
what he was doing as he was saying it.
Boy, working in the security industry.
That's an interesting concept.
Yes, yes, yes.
It's very, very alien.
I'm not concerned.
And if anyone is questioning the word hacker in our title,
we just want him to this episode.
Yeah, you go listen to that and then come back to us later.
Yeah, okay.
I some some gems there for sure, but I know what you want to do.
I don't think even it's about setting up a phone with all the tools
that you need for if you're a security tester.
So good good stuff there.
But I don't think you would use them in your regular Android phone
or such.
Probably not.
However, you might use them if you're deploying a Android device
to appeal the technicians or something.
So useful useful stuff, I imagine, for that use case.
And that again, speaking of contributions,
how to how to measure contributions, you know,
the one person who drops by this at five o'clock on a Friday
when Monday, Monday morning, they need to have a fleet of Android devices
rolled out to their tech department.
Thank you.
Thank you, operator.
So that's why we're here.
All that takes is one person to get benefit from our episode.
And then we've done our job.
Indeed, indeed.
So that was a good, a good, a good, a good, a total,
total versus livelihood, a contribution to discussion about
artificial intelligence in your course by me as a threat to our livelihoods.
And Bob says, and basically it was the identity,
and it was a response sort of to four or nine, seven,
will they take our jobs?
Of course they will, by dodo dummy.
And Bob says, we want free time.
What we get is more or less paid toil.
What we want free time, but what we get is more, less paid toil.
Yes.
Yep.
It could lead to more free time and the basic universal basic income.
However, what actually happens is that the person is required to do
other work involving more toil for less money to earn the same,
they need to do multiple of these jobs.
Okay.
Yep.
Yep.
Agreed actually.
Yes.
Yes, very much so.
So did we prompt this by talking about this general subject on the
previous community news?
I can't remember where that came from.
Anyway.
Katie Murray said it.
Thought.
And he decided to drop it off.
And it was because of dodo dodo.
Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes.
This is a responsible which we love to see.
Yes, it was.
The interactions are here, you see.
Not there.
Yep, yep, yep.
Are you, can you hear me?
Okay.
Yeah.
No, it's fine.
It's just sometimes the plates.
Okay.
So Katie Murray says, deep thought.
This one is going to need a second listen, smiley face.
Lots of good points made highlighting the massive grey zones,
but how and where we apply new technology to solve existing problems
in quotes or develop new ways of doing things.
Maybe we can find a way for people to leverage some tools to help them
make more HPRs or at least give themselves more time to do so.
Yeah.
Governor Brian Bravo.
I think the show is exactly right.
The objective of all economic policy should be minimizing the
amount of poiled people.
Toiled people do 100% for the win.
Star Trek.
Here we come.
100% unemployment.
A moment, which is, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
This is nice way of putting it.
Lander says, half the problem.
I think this episode highlights a very real problem.
Generative AI tools already depriving people of their livelihood,
which literally means staying alive.
I've been thinking a lot lately about the exploitation of workers
and what kind of economic systems could provide everyone
with a dignified standard of living as a layperson.
My very loose understanding is that universal basic income
is a front runner in that space.
Thanks so much for giving examples of other writings on this topic.
I'd love to hear more.
I do think there's a second problem with generative AI
that while less urgent than the first still matters.
Very good in a flood of bad harms.
A flood of bad harms both artists and audiences.
At least for some artists, the hope that the work finds an audience
is an important motivator.
For audiences, encountering work you love and knowing
it was made by a person with a perspective
affords the opportunity to find more works from that person
and better appreciate that perspective.
The ability to create low quality works coupled with systems
that prioritize clicks, search engines, engagement base,
social media algorithms, etc.
A recipe for dramatically increasing the difficulty
of finding good art.
As a small aside, I discovered one of my favorite visual artists
only because they were commissioned to create a logo,
something that might never have happened if generative AI
had been pervasive 10 years ago.
Very good.
Yeah, that's very insightful.
D&T says,
You are right about the problem of saturating the universe
with AI generated things.
This is in response to the previous comment.
However, I would say that good art has long been buried
under a mountain of low quality works created by humans for pay,
sitting in for the eventual AI,
just as what was done for factory workers in decades past.
Perhaps AI will expand the volume of low quality work
to a point where there was a strawy the system
of which it was is the ultimate evolution.
Good point.
D&T says reference K.D. Murray,
H.Fair only has to survive a couple more decades
before we win the 20-hour work week
and we can permanently retire the reserve queue.
I believe.
Thanks.
I hope I leave that one as soon as possible.
Yeah.
The following day we have called Jams 0-3.
I like this.
All songs are considered.
Not that I was particularly into the songs.
I did listen to them.
Yeah.
I enjoy music on H.Fair.
We look forward to it to that sort of thing.
And I saw this coming through
and I didn't listen to the show early
but I saw all the links and followed them all.
And some of those are really, really good.
There's some lovely stuff there.
I think he did so fairly short slices from which was great.
But that guy at the end, Daniel Bautista,
who I think he's
one of the sites I use.
I forgot his name now.
That open source stuff where he's doing re-workings
of classical music and stuff.
And there's some absolutely brilliant stuff there
to be looked at.
So yeah, this was just a great eye-opener.
So thank you very much for this.
Oh, it's cool.
And all songs consider things open.
Not anybody.
So if you got, you're thinking of future DJ work
in your future,
put together three or four songs.
He had two, five.
I was about right.
Between five, three, five, you know, the usual.
And let us have a listen to your playlist.
And of course, they all need to be great in pannins
or public domain.
Yeah, I'm preferably.
We no longer take it if you've got permission
from the author.
We no longer take those.
And so don't go to all the work unless, you know,
the creative commons.
Yeah.
Yep.
Yep.
No, very enough.
Check, check and double check.
And if one of them is creative commons,
CC by NC, if non-commercial,
then the whole show needs to be non-commercial.
Just by the way.
Yeah.
Something for the future website,
probably if it's not there,
then very clear.
No, it's there.
All right.
Is it okay?
I tend not to know these things.
I'm not until I get refreshed.
That's something about the website.
We have a lot of information.
Okay, first start.
Nobody reads the website until they need to read the website.
Yeah, yeah.
Our main attraction with people is via the feed.
Half the people wouldn't notice if we revamp the website.
But people do go to the website on a regular basis to check stuff.
So sometimes you want to be able to.
The target audience needs a ban.
This is what we're all about.
And they need a quick answer.
And sometimes it's more nuanced.
Where it's full how to that.
That we want.
So I'm interested to know on examples of other people's side,
not expecting you to do it.
Just other examples of other sites where.
That you think, hey, have a look at this site.
And you can contact us at admin at HackerPublicRadio.org.
Or on the best places actually on the.
Matrix channel in the HackerPublicRadio room on the Matrix channel.
You'll get us.
And I just realized the other day that the same account you can jump into.
Other people's rooms now with you matrix account.
I jumped into the Fedora one the other day.
That's nice actually.
It's kind of cool.
So yes, more samples.
Have a look at this freely open source website.
Is that something that HBR could do that sort of thing?
Yeah.
Next day, I guess there were no comments on this.
For some reason.
South Carolina.
I'm not doing the accent.
Charleston.
Charleston.
South Carolina and head back home.
We leave because last week they were there.
Our last month they were there.
They weren't as ages ago.
But we discussed it last month.
And I got the pronunciation of Charleston wrong.
You corrected me Dave.
I did.
And you've not forgiven me.
I know.
Exactly.
Again, lovely.
This travel episode.
If you're also doing that.
If you're also doing going somewhere.
Yeah, take a take a.
Do this.
Now we don't want to be overrun by travel episodes, but you know.
It was shout.
Definitely something to be said for.
I've enjoyed these a lot.
And this.
This was the last in the in this particular series, wasn't it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think last.
Full.
Complete last.
It might be a follow up episode explaining why it's the last.
I will be nice to have.
Yes.
But it sounded, you know.
But a very sort of leisurely.
Return with plenty of stops to.
To cater for the factor.
It's damn tiring driving this.
This big, big rig and.
Yeah.
And you know, for a.
Negotiate in your way back.
Back home, especially heading from warm places to.
To very cold places.
In fact, in fact, I hadn't quite considered it.
But yeah, yeah.
It's a great.
But you can tell the level of experience and how comfortable they were.
From the first episode in this series, the way back to the first episode.
To now, you know, that it's like day and night.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
We were very much.
We didn't know this.
We didn't do the crash.
We didn't lose.
Well, we didn't get our.
Our.
Our stop.
Yeah, stairs.
Stepping stairs.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
They were old hands by the time.
Yeah.
This was.
Was logged.
Yeah.
Well, plenty Roy sent in a nice episode on the road wireless microphone.
I want a better way to.
Check out the audio of your equipment in.
Then to record a podcast with said microphone.
I want to miss our links to the product page or something that we could buy it.
Yes.
Yes.
Although you.
You find loads of stuff, but.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But it doesn't give a killer one.
It doesn't give that specific thing.
No.
No.
I'll check the transcript.
Mm hmm.
No.
Yeah.
Oh, okay.
No.
We could do with that transcript.
Or we could.
We have the transcript.
We could do with the.
Show.
The model number.
That would be great.
Because then we can put in photos.
That would be.
That would be nice.
That would be nice.
Yes.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I wasn't sure how you.
Prem紩s this word.
The key adds an E sound on the end of it, but it's actually road, according to the.
You've got to look up industrial.
I'm a stick little bit of this sort of thing.
So, forgive me, but.
Really it.
Surprise air.
You're really surprised.
And.
Yeah.
Also.
It's got an oh.
There's a thing with a line to it.
Scandan ocean.
Scandinavian word.
read it or something like that but it's not it pronounced it wrong and yeah
anyway so I know something I don't know whether you can really run one unless
you've got to run the setup unless you've got windows so it seems to say that
support software is not for Linux if I didn't get that wrong so I was a bit
disappointed to hear that because I'd love to own some of them yeah to be
lost to me though my zoom H2 is good enough more than enough quality yeah yeah
my zoom is poking tires here's a stick there my zoom H2 anywhere it's
called sits on the dashboard of my car and I chat to people no the
dashboard of my car
people point and get all those people doing with that microphone and no they
don't actually bet they might do anyway yes good show though I enjoyed
that very much following day we had but also a good series if you got a
microphone there is one thing that people who are planning and getting it
the podcasting seem to like is leaving the exception is what microphone to
get good microphones are cheap affordable microphones yeah so following day
was a show by Crystal that I interviewed Mark Balmer and Christoff Bonner and
Christoff you will know or you won't know but I will from Fostem we met
several times regular there do in the ham radio booth really great guy had
asked me literally three years ago to do an episode about podcasting and
stuff and helping us the ham radio community and every time we we
agreed to have a interview I think about five times but you know the crap
that's going on in my life at the moment just seemed to over-track intersect
with us but it was good to be able to get in touch on a really great
really pushing amateur radio for the hacker community and my God was is this
going to be an event and a half I really really want to go but I've also
committed to going to on camp this is only a month before
that's a shame that's a shame I'm good I shout it up to modern weekend in
Paris in September or conferences yeah yeah imagine I was trying to talk my
my kids into coming to camp with me just because they like Manchester very
much I like to be partnering around there so do you want to come with me you
know and then you you can dry dry I know we can share the dry yeah yeah I'm not
trying to get you to drive me because I'm too old to drive for that distance
at no they said no it busy at other things yeah no it's their their last
day they're absolutely absolutely
I'm just on second one I'm making notes and things okay anyway but this
interview was about Spectrum 24 which is going to be awesome it's about the use
of the spectrum you don't have to be an amateur radio you just need to be
interested in anything wireless Bluetooth anything to do with hacking wireless
stuff you didn't got a wireless you're interested in this so be there or be a
cube yes no it sounds like it's going to be pretty good actually yeah as you
say this we all got some form of wireless in our in our houses the most I'm
currently using is a wireless mouse for example the keyboard isn't but yeah so
all that sort of stuff is good to good to have a good insight into how it all
works and stuff absolutely the following day we had key pass XC updates and
loving getting these cuz it's important I run keep as XC and it's important
to get the updates I'm really glad that some guy in the internet is doing this
stuff for us something on internet is very close to getting a great
mop dude just say yes you've got a whole new palace of mobs out the back there
did you see the one yeah the shiny ones yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah we got the old
crappy ones there in the corner of the new shiny ones with the go faster stripes
yeah no it's good good show yeah it was I just been reading up about keep
us XC in the context of Debian where they're they're trimming back some of the
the features in it for the Debian release you know how Debian does do you
know changes the names of things and and so reduce them in functionality and
stuff so it's a bit of a bit of a to-do argument about it I yeah yeah anyway
but it was good to hear this because it put it in the in context better than I
had managed to do myself so far yeah excellent no I didn't know I needed these
shows but apparently I do yep so developing a project
collaborating to develop an alternative time system now when this came in I
did not know or I had something in my head that was going to be different than
what Lee sent in and so far Lee shows have been absolutely very engaging very
different sort of shows but absolutely like fought on the break what so if you
haven't listened to the show we'll do the comments without going into too much
discussion about it and then carve yourself out a few minutes to go listen to
this so now that you should be listening to all the other ones yes so yes
Trace definitely yeah double-take stuff just finished with that thought yep
on you go Trace says not now another time thank you for sharing this and for
noting my episode about ship skills which as I recall he promised more shows
on it but I needed to dig into his research more I was really captured by your
connection between ADHD and procrastination and I've dealt with this
personally personally for decades it has only been the last few months that I've
been realizing realizing how many of my behavior traits are tied back to my ADHD
may might be why I have not just recorded another additional episode of my
time keeping series not now though another time smiley face that's where he
puts you on me a show and a good point I have a notebook here where I write all
your names you know and everybody mentions or if you even think about doing a
show I write it down here yeah yeah and then it gives that look no no no no there's
no judgment at all no judgment at all no it's just there it's fine
D&T says projects this was great I look forward to the future in which we've
all have more free time to talk this wink winky face this show made me wonder
how the 24 o'clock emerged and what other ways to partition the day may have
existed before it I've toyed with tracking my thousand day marks instead of my
birthdays thought came to me from the name of the the tool album 10,000 days what
if we celebrated 10,000 day marks instead of our anniversary it's awesome yeah good
good question but that's fascinating yes very very interesting show it's one of
those that you definitely suddenly find yourself attending more more closely just
just stop just turn that kettle off that's boiling no and just stop the water running as you're
doing the washing up oh wow this is really interesting and it's definitely it's
effective and as always of course your hands up all the water and gunk and you've
gone and your eyes are you just chop and vegetable to something
okay good job good job more more of that side of the thing the following day we had me
with installing home assistant operating system on it's yeah until it's six architecture 64-bit
architecture and that was that part of a series there's more to come in that series there were
no comments and we'll move on okay and the reason you're doing these episodes is so that we have
a grounding that if you're doing an episode on integrating with home assistant you will be able
to do that and you can then point to the corpus if you want to know how to install HBR you can point
back to these shows yeah that's why we're doing these boring plans we're laying the foundation
yeah and the following day we have podcasting for newbies all you need to become a good
podcaster with all sorts of links or references at least two microphones and stuff that you can get
involved I genuinely couldn't believe the moss wasn't wasn't HBR regular there you go
yeah yeah yeah I mean we know of him I imagine many people know it's voice because they
list off podcast and they listen to the new year show as I said before and yeah it's it's really
really good to have him on board welcome welcome welcome and more please yep absolutely
so as we get to the end of the month there's less chance of comments because as yet
and retrophone with the pie g pie two case and I was digging a hole in the garden while I was
listening to this and I didn't get a chance to look at the uh at the case itself until I look
again but it's about putting uh Kevin's doing a series actually I think we call it on the
raspberry pie and different uses for ease so very nice keeping common yeah this is good this is
good I think I would want personally because I think I could even see the screen but it sounds
sounds like a lot of fun yeah yeah yeah it was good to have an in-depth analysis of the device
so yeah excellent so what it is is essentially a game boy case that you put the raspberry pie
pico or w1 raspberry pie into the salt and then into a game boy case that's kind of cool kind of
cool I never was into the game boy so my son was son had one so he was he's quite interested in that
subject cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool and then we had a show that caused us much much
problems 30 years on the internet nightwise online uh how the internet changed like
great show I like these conversational ones with nightwise the reason was he changed the show
earlier on which causes problems then and then this show is truncated at the end so we don't know
how how that happened and how we missed it is a point yeah yeah that's uh that's that's the most
surprising thing really yeah I don't listen too far ahead to the future feed but I do listen to it
uh so we get ahead of the game when it comes to doing these shows um but uh yeah and how we
manage not to hear that it was it suddenly stops in a surprising place I don't know yeah I don't
know uh maybe it's because I'd already heard the the show before uh because we had a very similar
one uh sent in and then we changed it and then this one came in and uh the update that
you sent also was cropped so that's uh let me help so um so currently we're left we may never know
how it ends we may never know if nightwise gets his fame and fortune from the nightwise to come
podcast we shall have to uh tune for part two however zen floater was more than happy to comment
the wv dial I've been on the internet for over 30 years but with Linux it has just been 30 years
and you can blame the box set of slackware Linux and a program called wv dial for all of this but
I'm still on golfer on sdf and a link there to uh golfer and install p fetch for your golfer
browser program it works well that's good tip actually because uh I'm looking for this yeah I've
not looked at that one it used to be able to use the golfer protocol in browsers but that
vanished didn't it some number of years ago um I said uh rss feeds in the browser which was
you know it was on the last wave of podcasting when people realized they couldn't monitor
his podcasting and now suddenly podcasting is everywhere everybody's got a podcast
so I'm surprised that that was taken out yeah no um I think the valdi which I'd use on and off
because he's got some nice features uh you can um do some sort of feed related thing in it
but I'm not used it because it doesn't seem to be any better than an antenna pod on my phone but
yeah but yeah it's uh it's an interesting thing I don't know if I want to get back into golfer
might be worth having a look so you see use it I have said many times before that we use it a lot
in the university I worked for um in the in its early days because it was a great way of
communicating around the campus and putting short term stuff up for people or you know
we even tried to put in bus time tables on it or something I can't remember all the details now but
yeah so it's a it's a it's a good thing good thing um yeah okay um how I find found Hacker
Public Radio just by Henrik uh who came to us via mintcast I was not aware of this and I should have
been and there you go need to get on mintcast and have a chat with those guys it's on my list of
the if there was only somebody over there who uh could uh yes yes yes good I tend I have
listened to them for many years I've cut down my podcast listening because I'm just
just too busy but yeah they they they always very friendly towards HPR but yeah they're good guys
but this was this was good I enjoyed this um yeah this this show because of the the way he was
he was sort of describing the steps to defining the ultimate golfer Hacker Public Radio
they have to yeah it's good to have him on board and this is hugely useful for us here in light of
in light of this episode that's nightwise just um because it does tell us where to focus our
attention um so yeah please consider doing a if you have not done a show you are listening to this
there is kind of an element where you know you're not part of the community until we know about you
yeah so we we may be a hacker space but there's a two there's a one-way mirror on that on that wall
of the hacker space right you're looking in on the other side we don't know you can see us but we
can't see you yeah so unless you're not going to door and come in and have a cup of coffee
we don't know you exist you're more than welcome to come in and you do that by saying hi my name is
bob uh i'm from blah this is my thingy and this is how i found hvr yeah very simple and that's
that's at least we know you exist yeah so one show is fine one show you're big great but one show
is fine that's all we're asking then then you are a podcaster you are a member of the community
we know you exist everything's great we can move on and then we will have them tape
we start asking them questions oh that's interesting you do we show next thing they're checking in
commits into git yes just because everybody knows it's our plan doesn't make it a skill doesn't mean
that's not a clever and clever and clever and clever and clever and clever and clever and clever
lord okay civilizations part three part three oh man the text to speak on this one drove me
knots trying to get a right i think it's archerismist that has the new text to speak
thing that is on my list to do oh yeah yeah yeah yeah to this sooner we can get rid of this one
the better the uh who car reminds me of early doctor who in special car i'm going oh oh no no
they mean a hooker that's fine but yeah any who yes uh there we are about the game no comments on
that so it's good good good to hear about though yeah yeah yeah it starts to get a bit more
challenging and combative at this low I uh I listen to these back in the summer when you
post them so all right right right now I tend to want to not to do that no no I have to do
it close to the show because otherwise I'll totally forgotten well yeah but we bring up
on important points there folks uh we are going to be changing the feeds shortly and I just
realized that people subscribed to this episode and yeah okay right um what else do we do Dave normally
we've done the shows from previous month there was we got common one comment yeah yeah and this
is on the show getting started with DigiCam photo management that's Henrik sent in and he was
replying good support replying to his own show good support from DigiCam developers and
community in the show I recommended to join the support mailing list for DigiCam a couple of days
ago I used a specific use case I had a specific use case I could not find out how or even if I could
I could not find out by trial nor find anything in the manual I said Mrs a straightforward question
to the DigiCam user mail is and after about two hours one of the developers responded that that
was what I wanted to do is not currently possible but a blog report for the use case already existed
of course not every question is answers so properly but again and again I'm amazed but the
answer is given by both the community and the developers cool that's right that's a great
detail yes that's really interesting I mean it might be fixed but at least you know there's
something going on yeah yeah yeah it's on the one right here whether it'll ever get there is another
question but it's moved forward so uh people's homework for this mod Dave is uh the specific people
I've mentioned who are architectry and website design you have your homework you're exempt from
that but for the rest of you guys and we will be looking for what I'm looking for
help yes listening to the future feed yes speaking of the future feed
but let's do they archive mail archive so the community yeah
yeah community decisions are made on the mail list so we read out the mail list so the first
one is posting questions to the communication community about syndication rules by Taj
Kyle I and the other you random guys had a question regarding syndication rules I reached out
to the judges and this just that I posted this question to the mail list during the recording of our
next episode we've planned a great deal of time talking about HPR specifically in response
episode 4109 the future of HPR by nightwise we've discussed about the ability of
costing out that section and attributing it as a show recording a new intro specifically for HPR
we would like to do this and still include that section in our own show it would air much earlier
on HPR than within our show does this violate any syndication rules false
not sure if we need to read out everybody gone yes that's fine because pretty much it was that
yes yes we had we had yeses from from a number of people in
us yeah so from Carl Brian I asked the same question Todd Andrew Henrik Claudio Kevin and Jason
all responded and it is actually allowed under the syndication rules because if it's recorded
at the same time it was for HPR I mean didn't start out intentionally it being for HPR but it turned
out to be for HPR during the discussion you could tell that they were saying that and then it was
posted first to us so but very that is exactly an example of the code of conduct that we don't have
that people follow you know it's been respectful and yeah great great example um pocketcass
speaking of people who are not respectful so pocketcass I'm in completely other things
no uh pocketcass as people will know I've discussed
or um when uh links in those were discussing about mirroring that um lots of people take our feed
and they uh have it on their website but the actual files come from our server and specifically
the internet archive server were being honest so um the uh so the normally what they do is if you
go to iTunes or even IMDB now apparently apparently we're on IMDB Dave who knew
uh yeah so if you take on there um they pull down the rss feed and they host that rss feed on their
site and then we get to see it and then if somebody clicks the link comes into us and we get to see
the source IP address of the person and then why that's important is because what pocketcass do is
they act as a proxy or appear to I don't know looking at our logs they appear to act as a proxy so
when anybody presses uh fine podcast on the app it comes via the app and makes a request for the
rss feed on our site now Fiddy Murray contacted them and they uh they then removed all the feeds
that have got an appersand at the end which made me realize that this show has got an
appersand at the end Dave so we wanted to speak to the people on pocketcass just make sure that
they were getting their shows and now we can't do that because they've been truncated to cause
they no longer listen to this show right you know what I mean but the history uh community news is
the appersand so if you go to feed it's got a series uh link in it so I'm going to home
on the hr website and I go to get shows and then I have rss syndication and then I've got one show
month if you're overwhelmed by the amount of shows we produce then this is a good place to start
and that's the community news so it's this show so a lot of people told us that they uh told us
in person not at events that there's too much so we told them to listen to this show and then
go back and cherry pick the ones that they want to listen to um but it's uh HPR on the score
org on the score rss.php question mark series equal 47 and now they've removed that meaning
anybody on pocketcass who's subscribed will start no what will happen is they will get stop
getting the community news but they'll start getting everything else so it's okay okay
panic averted panic averted what's yeah yes so this is it will include an idea of what we have to
think about here on the hr yeah yeah yeah yeah I sort of get a bit bit uh bamboozled by this
but they're willing that will include the community news yeah exactly only the community news so
so that in a way it's good I guess um yeah yeah yeah but what we we are currently working through
cutting up the rss feeds anyway and we're going to switch from uh dynamic feeds where they're
generated on the fly using a lamp you know the next attack you might as well so we're going
from that to having them generated on the static site um and that way we're just serving a file
from the uh from the disk and that's that's fine that's easy peasy lemon squeezy um but we will then
be we need to look at putting in slugs which are a term for a fixed endpoint URL for our hosts
rss feeds series etc etc so that everybody gets a static xml feed for their shows
every series gets a static xml feed for their shows and that sort of thing so changes are
are coming uh we're also thinking about an opus feed so uh uh not sure how many people still
listen to the speaks feed but apparently quite a few um and I saw thousands on the speaks feed
which had me confused because before it was like 10 people of which 11 of them were me um
odd they were all pocket cast as well so I noted what they were doing it just went to the website
and picked every feed apparently uh and then kept it I I don't know uh and I don't care actually
as long as it's great of common people take the feed take the stuff I don't care that's what
I'm supposed to do so another thing that I'm thinking of doing is a not a feed without a uh a feed
without um media so text only but so it would include their show notes and then it would include
they um it would include they transcript with a link to each section so that you can click on
the link and then go directly to the audio and it will start playing the audio at that point
the issue with that is show notes are showcases by the media players but I don't know what are
people's thoughts on that sort of thing sounds interesting what truncates show notes again
the specification so only 4,000 characters yeah yeah yeah if somebody's waffling all for three hours
not that anyone would do that here on this show no no no no no how long has it been I can
yeah yeah but yeah yeah I I having just been tinkering with the air and says feed um there is a
there is a chop chopping process going on for the um uh apple ones and uh and stuff
I they called I something or other um yeah yeah and and another and the google one as well
is truncated yeah yeah yep so okay yeah that's that yeah that explains it and sometimes they
they're cut just on by character which is uh which you end up at the end of it which is
not as bit bizarre yeah but we'll have a look at that we are looking at at stuff improving you know
if people can read stuff and work what have to listen to boring you know you're sitting in a
teens meeting you could be browsing the it's pure feed so there was that um and I also want to
talk about the uh about the CDN stuff and mirroring both I but it's probably too early and I'll
do it in the normal shot so that's it yeah well I am I posted a um thing I normally do a message
to the mailing list saying we're meeting on Sunday but um unfortunately today's not Sunday it's
Friday and I'll explain why in a minute when we get on to the any other business
ah yeah oh do you want to do that now yep okay so uh we've got a bunch of things under
aob first one is a proposed policy change changed the show last during the month uh where
we're asked to remove it it already been uploaded uh transcoded etc uploaded to the archive
to org etc and we were asked to remove it um and and free the slot that is not a thing that
is trivial at all it's really complicated and I've listed some of the elements of it which I won't
read out just now but um I think that the policy should be and we think that the policy should be
we're asking if you need to read the policy should be okay the factors which um uh needed the the
factors which cause us to make this request is the amount of work involved in making this
change is not trivial it's not possible to remove archive to org items they're locked in place
wherever you've got to be very very high up there and there's no point in asking only all you
can do is remove all the contents and replace them to leave them as a sort of partial show and
then replace the the guts of the the show with whatever occupies that uh particular number slot
later on so the process involved in that deletion and replacement are not hugely complex but
they're they're pretty labor intensive so uh it took me quite some number of hours to get it sorted
plus there's also ramifications into existing feeds because of feeds tend to be cached
by whatever um and uh so there will be in your podcast uh player most likely a reference to
the show as was and it will be replaced when the new denizen of that slot appears yeah um so we're
proposing that the policy be changed to discourage this except in severe cases thanks to a
copper or a legal consequences and we we we take great care that incoming shows are unlikely
to trigger such problems in the first place so we're hoping that that will um with the policy and
diligence will result in there being um very very very few cases of uh seven eating to do this
and to that point uh the future feed so there is a feed which is normally referred to as the
future feed and it can be found on an order assess syndication page so if you go to get shows
you'll get it on that page it receives shows which are posted out of order as they come in
and maybe you replaced or reposted if errors are found this is intended as it means to find
issues with metadata or the audio quality of the new shows before they hit the main feed
recently a show was posted to this feed which was truncated unfortunately although the janitors
and the number of this lose follow this feed the truncation was not spotted until the show was
released it would be very much appreciated if you could assist with watching this feed for
future errors and for errors in the future please contact janitors if you notice anything
cool okay next topic was janitorial team and we've alluded to this already we've had some
recent contributions to the development of the HBR software from Norrist and from Katie Murray
to who we think and we also added them to we yeah we added them to the HBR answers
closet great name on matrix to speed up discussions about open tickets and if anyone else wishes
to help out the development please do so by creating a camp on our githy server linked from the
notes and we had some issues with account creation over there and our actual admin who pays for
the site josh as an honest host dot com fixed it for us free of charge as always and now you can
create accounts over there as well i'm also thinking that in the future we will be doing a lot more
with the with gith and the wiki part of gith we will probably be integrating stuff like series
you know show notes for series into gith with artistry so think of the amateur radio section
i want to do the harrick which is the harmonized amateur radio exam which is used in the majority
of the world it means your license from the us you can go to australia or the Netherlands and
you can use your license or transfers between countries without having to do another exam so
really really good thing if you're a amateur radio but additionally if you're just into
hobby electronics there's whole sections there on hobby electronics and if you're into the
theory of radio waves because it's for your work or something you're not interested in amateur radio
there's going to be a lot of sections in there so what all of these topics like what colors are
resistors for example little episodes that people can do over time and you know can add creative
commons stuff to the to the wiki which will then be published on the series section on the website
so that's kind of division there so if you want to make an account please go ahead and do so
there counters mandatory for security reasons moving on good um last one on the any other business
list is it just to let everybody know that there's been denial of service attacks on the internet
archive recently so a number of DDoS that's distributed denial of service attacks have occurred
on this this service in recent past and um I think Jason Scott who is a uh member of
works for the internet archive and also um has uh on occasion um sent messages to us on
HBR on various contexts um interesting chap if you would like to follow him at all um anyway he's
yeah he calls himself the free range archivist at the internet archive things are mastered on so if
you but uh there's no real understanding of why but but these sorts of events often not really
don't follow any any normal logic as far as I can take make out but what it means as far as
it's very concerned that sometimes the internet archive can be unavailable because it's
in the middle of one of these and uh so it's not possible to upload stop to the service there which
is what we need in order for the shows to to become visible in there in the feed so I mean we
we go to great lengths to uh to work around it and uh and whatever um and we've got various tools
that will help us with that but uh it still could be a bit of a problem in some cases um and the
thing I was going to comment on was the fact that uh we had planned to record on Sunday with
you getting the show ready to release uh midnight on Sunday GMT or UTC um but we decided we wouldn't
do that because the DDoSers are being targeted at weekend so the chances were that we would not be
able to upload the the show as somebody stayed up all night um trying to wait a bit to finish or
something um so we're actually recording on the Friday I'm going to send a message to the
mailing list in a while just to say sorry guys but we're we're not going to be there on Sunday if
you wanted to join us okay yeah um and about that's a the size self is paid for by Josh from
anonymoushost.com out of his own pocket don't know why he does it it's just a nice guy what he does
it and also deals with our uh these with our stuff uh so big thanks to him if you're ever looking
for good hosting I can I can highly recommend uh the customer service of anonymoushost.com links
on every page of HBR and if you've got some shettles um tax-free stuff send it over to the internet
archive not tax-free stuff still send it over to the internet archive their website redirect
website host the feeds and stuff but the media itself all comes from the internet archive and
we're completely reliant on them uh for serving the shows so I don't think this DDoS affects the
serving of the shows as much because that's distribution across multiple servers but it means that
the upload uh processes is the one that's getting hammered so if we can get it up you'll probably
get it despite the DDoS while getting it up is is the issue uh that's why um I want to talk about
the community curated his content delivery network that I've spoken about before um probably not
as much as I should have done because uh kitty marie seems to happen heard about it so uh the idea
is that we've got hammered before with the DDoS attacks on hacker public radio as well you know
and really all you can do is just either put your stuff in front of a public CDN like um cloud
flare or whatever and then that means you know somebody coming in on tour won't be able to get
to our thinking because they're blocked any suspicions activity so you know it's it's balancing
freedom and the internet goals of hpr with how we're going to get the site to you so uh the plan
was that we would make everything you know everything uh on hpr is owned by the community so in theory
except you know except the logging credentials to put the stuff up on the website in the first
place fine but in theory not in theory in fact you can go and now download everything including
your database or sync all the files and get absolutely everything and run hpr and your own server
so um in another move I have now a gigabyte fiber connection to my house of which I'm using
a quarter of that at the best of times so my plan is to put a hard disk and a server on my network
and people can just mirror the media and everything from my my house and if the internet goes down
or hack a public radio goes down we go to the matrix channel or twitter or wherever we get you
and say well we've moved to new hacker public radio dot org or whatever and then we just continue on
as we do so if you're interested in hosting hpr uh on your uh premises that's something that you
you can do and even if you don't make a public you can still do that just for the crack um if you
if you're interested in technology and you want to know what it is to run a big website
this is a big website so there's lots to learn here if you're just learning about web hosting different
ways of hosting it with a database hosting it with static file generation we're doing a lot of
cool stuff here uh we don't publicize that enough but the information is there so feel free to use it
if you're interested in hosting uh a go for engine for example and you've got a Raspberry Pi
and a hard disk uh you need i think a four terabyte hard disk now four terabyte hard disk we put all
our stuff on it and then you put a go for server on the front of that and you put it on your
on your website and host it off your internet connection and even if you don't have an internet
connection and interested in doing that here i have a Raspberry Pi right here look can you hear that
i have a whole wall of raspberry pies that you can have and run whatever cool project that you
think of on it it's your data don't miss the fact that you don't have the resources
stand in your way of doing something cool with it yep and singles for APIs and stuff or
um if you think hey it would be useful if you had a statistic page for example that i could
trigger a alarm bell to ring off when there's a commons comes in yeah we can do that who would do
that come on well have we have we talked this one out i'm getting a horse name i think we have
yeah yeah me too all right i better um i better actually uh we better stop recording
process this and i'll upload it so that you can spend the weekend trying to get it onto the internet
archive and i just want to say what are in the world that will deduce the internet archives like
really okay now i need to put the link up in front of the
yeah yeah i agree i agree very strange okay tune in tomorrow for another exciting episode of hacker
public radio radio radio
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