hpr-knowledge-base/hpr_transcripts/hpr4453.txt

Episode: 4453
Title: HPR4453: IPv6 for Luddites
Source: https://hub.hackerpublicradio.org/ccdn.php?filename=/eps/hpr4453/hpr4453.mp3
Transcribed: 2025-10-26 00:52:20

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This is Hacker Public Radio Episode 4453, for Wednesday the 27th of August 2025.
Today's show is entitled, Ipsix for Luddites.
It is the 10th show of Vity, and is about 51 minutes long.
It carries a clean flag.
The summary is, when he tries to convince Andrew that disabling Ipsix isn't the solution.
Hello Hacker Public Radio listeners, it's McNally with you here, Andrew, if you prefer.
And I'm joined for this episode by Benny.
Hello Benny.
Hello Andrew.
The reason that we've come together to this HPR episode is we were playing our usual weekly game of,
well, it's not Dungeons & Dragons anymore, it's Pathfinder, isn't it?
And it's with Klaatu and Patrick, and who's many of you might know.
And then we got sidetracked with a discussion about IPv4 versus IPv6.
And I said something great, Luddite like, oh, I just turned off IPv6.
And then all my internet starts working on my device.
And I don't give any thought.
And then Benny proceeded to point out why this might not be a long-term strategy.
Well, basically that's a bit of a trigger for me.
Someone tells me it turns off IPv4, then I just go into a ranting mode and start.
Because if you try to debug IPv6 problems on the internet and you search the internet for a solution,
basically every solution you find is turn off IPv6.
Yeah, just, I like you to continue, but that's basically what happened in my mind when you said this.
Yes, indeed, yes, I triggered Benny.
Now to be fair, it has occurred to me that turning off IPv6 is only a short-term fix.
But in my defense, it's a short-term fix that serves me well now for 15 years.
It might even be longer, I can't remember where.
Yeah, I mean, it's obvious that no one wants to use those new protocols.
I mean, IPv6 is only worth 30 years old, so yeah, very new in terms of computers, where we think it's a lot of time to take them out.
30 years, isn't it really that old I had no idea?
Yeah, I think it's pretty much 30 plus was in the beginning of the 90s.
It was the first definite version was published.
Yeah, and actually IPv4 has been under for life for 15 years.
I think they decided in 2011, they decided not to develop anything new for IPv4 in protocol, not software.
Okay, so my position was sort of unconsciously, but I don't know if it's a word that has used outside the Britain, but a Luddite.
You heard of Luddites?
Yeah, absolutely.
Okay, and it refers to people, I think during the Industrial Revolution and Britain smashing up machinery, and I think there was a person called Henry Ludd, maybe.
Yeah, I don't think it's a fictitious person.
I don't know if this person existed, but somebody can correct me.
Anyway, the point is that my attitude is definitely that of a Luddite, that, oh, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
But I think it's fair to say that IPv4 is sort of broken, isn't it?
Well, in a global scale, yes.
Yeah, I mean, it works for you on your home internet currently, because you live in a sensible size country where you don't have billions of internet users on the internet,
but it stops working in Asian countries, because you need to carry a great nap to get on the internet.
And eventually, you run out of ports to use in a single IP address, and then things start to happen where a webpage loads.
But some images don't load because they can't open another connection.
And it's also getting more expensive for ISPs to run that carry a great nap.
I think that's also why even here, well, here, nothing's better because our ISPs live behind the moon or something, but I think in Germany, maybe even in Britain, ISPs started using IPv6 for mobile networks.
Because, of course, that's again, a lot of devices, where you don't want to deal with a nap.
Okay, so it's probably fair to say, well, what I expected to happen years ago was that there would be very little pressure on me in my home network to abandon IPv4, because there's no problem there.
It's just a local area network. You can carry on using IPv4.
But what I did expect to happen was for my ISP to tell me one day, and I thought this day would come five, 10 years ago, that you don't have a wide area network IPv4 address anymore.
Forget that. You've only got an IPv6 one, but still, least, and two internet providers I've used in the last year for my house, that's not true.
They will, they seem to be default to give me an IPv4 network on the wider internet.
Yeah, I think not many ISPs on a home internet, at least in Europe, started doing this. ISPs started doing this on mobile networks.
Might as well be that your phone, that if your phone is connected to the internet through your mobile provider, that it doesn't get a IPv4 address.
Nowadays, iPhones and Android phones work quite well without IPv4 connections, or IPv4 connectivity.
I think at home, the only thing that happened over the last couple of years is that you don't get a public IP address anymore from some home ISPs.
You would get the private ISP from those carrier-grade NAT ranges, which are not limited on the internet, and then they provide a huge network address translation infrastructure, which is expensive to run on their end.
That's why I think eventually ISPs want to get rid of IPv4, because it's more expensive to run this than to directly connect you to the internet over IPv6.
I suppose the thing that's possibly me is why this isn't more widespread, so you're seeing that probably for home internet users, it's slower to happen, but it's already happening with mobile devices.
Well, home internet users are in Europe, and I think all of them, I'm not sure about America, but it's definitely not true for the Asian market, I think India, and I'm pretty sure about China, I'm not sure about India, they're quite far with the translation to IPv6.
Okay, and I suppose what we should say again, I'll play dumb here, which is not that difficult, not that difficult, or anything that we don't play ignorant.
What was it that you remember in Galileo wrote some of his treatises, and he had the guy who explained things, and he had a character called Simplico, or something like that, he was like the idiot, he came up with his little tricks, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, so Simplico, Simplico, yeah, and yes, I'll be Simplico in this conversation.
All right, okay, okay, so we've already answered the question, we're running on IPv4 addresses, if we've answered that question, but how is IPv6 better than IPv4? What's the main difference?
I mean, the main difference is 96 bits in the address, means a huge address space, I mean, you've got 128 bits in an IPv6 address, and it simplifies, well, it doesn't simplify knowing addresses by heart, obviously.
Unless you get a very simple prefix from your ISP, but generally, it simplifies, it simplifies address management, because the space is so vast, you can just, every, every subnet you use, can just be a slash 64, which means you have 64 bits of prefix, you assign to the subnet.
And 64 bits, you can choose, you can choose for addresses, so you've got basically a huge space in every, in every single subnet.
Okay, and IPv4 was, so it's 2 by 4, 4 pairs of 2 bytes, so that'll be 64 bits, is that right, if I don't understand what I'm trying?
32?
Yes, I haven't done what I'm trying.
No way, no, 2 bytes, so it's 16 times 4, so it's 64, no, I've got something wrong.
And why 2 bytes? It's 4 times 1 byte.
Yes, sorry.
It's 1 byte between the periods, the dots.
Yes, sorry, that's 2 bytes, yeah, 1 byte total.
32.
Okay, yeah, okay, while we were talking there, I attempt to ask my Android phone, what, what is IP address was, and it just wouldn't tell me.
So I've now gone to what is my IP.com website, and it tells me my IPv4 address, and it tells me that I have no IPv6 address, so in the UK at least.
Okay, so your UK providers are the same, that's what's providers then.
Yeah, so this is, I'm in a 5G network by company O2, it's their network, so there you go.
Yeah, I think it's within every, every mobile provider with a 3, well, at least 3 that build actually infrastructure, the other ones are just.
They just use the networks of those 3 providers.
And none of them, this IPv6 on mobile, but I think in Germany it's almost everyone, if I'm not mistaken, I didn't, actually I didn't look this up, I just trusted our.
And then German consultant who claimed it is that way, so just.
If you, if you want to fact check me, all right, then yeah, just go ahead.
I'm talking to, I'm talking to the listeners too, of course.
The other amusing thing is that that website decided to be my, I was in the city of Colin C. Double L. I.N.
And I went, no, I'm not near, well, from an any city I'm in Glasgow, I'm not quite in Glasgow.
And Colin turns out to be a tiny little village in the south of Scotland, so.
Interesting.
Okay, so yeah, so I'm not sure I would take that, that bit of research there as gospel, although it was done live during the recording of this episode.
Okay, so yeah, so we've got a much, we're basically no way in the foreseeable future for a external IPv6 addresses.
But that's a sort of, actually, that's a total of just things I just said, there's no way to foresee it in the foreseeable future.
Yeah, I mean, I mean, not even the whole, I think.
Only a tiny part of the IPv6 address space has been assigned to.
To all the regional, what's the name?
Right and all of them.
Okay.
And a huge, huge chunk of the space is still unused.
So I think we could, the whole set of wooded currently with IPv6 was all the.
Handling out of addresses in different countries and different continents.
I think we could do this over another seven times.
And still not run out of addresses.
I think it's about one eight of the space has been used.
Yeah, one thing just occurred to me is we talked about IPv4, so it's IP version four.
And we're talking about IP version sex, what happened to version five?
We're done.
I've got no clue.
I think I'll look this up at some point, but I don't remember.
I think it was some, some kind of development version that never made it into into even a final.
A final specification.
But this might be complete nonsense.
Okay, yeah.
I'm just looking up quickly.
It looks like it didn't develop properly.
Yeah.
It became apparent that it wasn't going to fix the problem.
Yeah.
Also.
Yeah.
So yeah, that's what it was.
It just.
Yeah, they decided to start again.
Yeah.
Okay.
And so, okay, so we've done the.
So it was 32 bits versus 128, but.
Are there any other differences?
I mean, yeah, there are five six.
I mean, there are a lot of differences.
I'm not sure what difference is.
It's our worth talking about.
I mean, I mean, one, one main difference is that.
ARP.
The ARP protocol is going away.
The protocol that's called the three placing ARP is called neighbor discovery.
It ended space and IP.
So it's, it's basically based on IP ICMP messages.
So if you want, if you come from an IPv4 background and you've got ARP and ARP is turning along below the whole IP.
I mean, network and you say, well, I'm security conscious.
I'll disable ICMP totally and I won't use ICMP at all.
IPv6 won't work.
You won't even, you won't even be able to connect to your neighbors in your.
In your local area network because you don't discover your neighbors because this is done via.
The neighbor solicitation message, which is an ICMP message type and the neighbor answers using a neighbor advertising thing.
Yeah.
And you do the same thing to, to discover your, your gateway.
You do a router solicitation and the router answers with a router advertisement, which, which can replace the HTTP.
Because you can, you can add options or extensions to router advertisements like the DNS servers.
You can, the router can tell a machine that's coming on the network. Well, hello, I'm your router.
I'll, I'll take your traffic to the internet and, by the way, that's here.
Those are your DNS resolvers use those.
And, and then, I mean, that's, of course, now I said you're not going to use the HTTP.
So I guess you're asking how, how do I get in the rest then?
I mean, you should DHCP just gives you an address.
The thing that's happening is you just get the prefix from the router.
Well, that's, that's your prefix is the first 64 bits.
I mean, the router gives you this first 64 bits and says, well, that's your prefix.
I just make up an address.
And then you go ahead and just, I mean, because you've got still 64 bits.
And if you just randomly choose 64 bits, chances are very, very low.
Then you hit an address that's already present on the network.
But in case you do, there is also a thing called WKD address detection built into the protocol.
You basically send out the message asking for someone else who has this address or uses this address.
And if someone answers, you just roll the dice again.
There was also, there was also a way to, to configure the address, depending on the MAC address of the network interface.
Because you just, I think it's also 32 bits.
How long is the MAC address? Don't remember.
Never mind. You can just embed MAC address in the second 64 bits.
But of course, that's from a privacy perspective.
That's a bad thing to do because you will always get on the network.
Even, even on different networks, you will always be identified by your MAC address.
And they can tell what the vendor your device is from and so on.
So that's why nowadays, generally, those addresses are randomly generated.
Okay. Yeah. I just looked, I think MAC address actually has six bytes.
Okay. Yeah. I thought it was not as long as an IP before address.
Yeah. I also noticed you'd be pleased to know that in my house, my laptop, I'm speaking right now, has an IPv6 address.
Oh, that's very good. What does it look like?
It is one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, two byte numbers.
And the middle one, the central one, hang on, the fourth one, sorry, is, well, the third one, if you can start counting it zero, is in fact zero, which I guess delineate one bit from the prefix from the non prefix, but yeah, doesn't have to be a bit wait.
And you said eight, eight, two bytes, the two times age of 16 bytes. That's not yet 16 times 16 times.
Are, are you aware that this is a hexadecimal?
Yes, it is a hexadecimal. Okay. Okay. Does it, does it include two columns somewhere without the number in between?
Because no. Well, actually, wait, wait, wait, hang on, there's two lines. So I see it says i net, which is my IPv4 address, then it's got i net six.
And the first is got, that's got two lines actually. And the first line ends with link and that does have to call on this next to each other and it only has two, three, four, five pairs, pairs of bytes.
And I think those pairs are pairs of two bytes because it's four, it's four, four hexadecimal numbers and two hexadecimal numbers are a byte.
Right. Okay. Yes, that's true.
And then, then it's correct again. So the first line, what does, what does the first, first block of numbers, the first four bytes, what do they look like?
The first one is hexadecimal and the second one is just two columns. Yeah, but what does it look like? I mean, what, what's the actual number that?
Well, if 80 is the first. Yeah. Okay. So that's a link local address. That's an address that's not rooted on the internet that every, every machine can configure a link local address in the local network.
That's how you get on the network in the first place because remember, we don't have our, if we don't have our, we don't have MAC addresses to get on the, on the network before we get an IP address.
So you need an IP address right from, from the beginning. And that's what you do. You just take FE 80, home, home, and then you just choose 64 bits randomly.
Okay. And that's what you can, you, you can use this to send out those router advertised, router solicitation messages to find your router and so on.
And then that's also a thing with IPv6, often your interfaces have more than one address.
So guess the second one is, is the proper IPv6 of this. Hopefully. Yes. Yes. Yes. That would, that would, that would, that would make sense. So we are, so the FE 80 is indicating that that's a local link address. You say yes. Yes.
And then it's was that, but then it says that the answer prefix length or prefix lane 64, but that makes it look like the prefix comes at the end.
Because then 64 bits afterwards, after the, no, that's the first 64, this works the same way as an IPv4 actually. If you have a slash 24 subnet, this means the first 24 bits are fixed for the network and the last eight bits can be chosen to make up the address.
And the only thing is that with IPv6, it's often 64 bits at the beginning and 64 bits at the end. But if you, if you're a provider, for example,
you get, you get huge blocks for, at work, we have, we have a slash 29 block that we can use from, from ripe, right, which means, which, which means we have 99 bits that is it 128,
minus 29, yeah, makes sense. 99 bits that we can choose, that we can use to choose networks from, or to segment our, our address space, right.
And at home for, for my ISP, usually from your ISP, you get a, if you have a sensible ISP, let's put it that way.
Then you will get a slash 48 or a slash 56, which means the first 48 bits or the first 56 bits are fixed and you're free to do whatever you want with the bits after this.
So you still have either, if you want to use 64 bits or slash 64 networks, then you still have either 8 or 16, 16, 48 to 64, yeah, 16 or 16 bits to assign your networks.
So I get a slash 48 for my ISP, so I can have still 16 bits that I can use to have different network segments of a slash 64 networks in my, my house.
Okay, so my, yeah, so my laptops, global address, it says prefix and 64, so it looks like the, it should always, the prefix length should always be six slash 64, so maybe this, maybe you get a slash 56 from your router and your router just decides, well, I'll just use the first slash 64 in this network.
Unless you do some other configuration where you use multiple subnets in your, near block, otherwise it will just assign the first one and use this.
I think there were providers, I think I'm not sure whether they stopped now, but I think there were providers that try to save address space that something you tend to do.
If you come from a IPv4 mindset, because with IPv4, everything was always about saving address space, right?
So if you, if you're not fully into this IPv6 mindset yet, you still try to save address space and they gave, I think they gave out slash 112 networks to their customers.
But the problem with this is it breaks a lot of things that depend on 64 bits, being able to be chosen randomly.
Okay, and the double colon indicates that everything, so if I see a double colon, that means all the bytes in there are zero.
Exactly. And of course, it can, it can appear exactly once, because obviously otherwise it's not.
Okay, so the big example is just call on call on one, which means it's all zeros except for the last number, which is one.
Okay, exactly.
Which is much nicer than one to seven dot zero dot zero dot one, which always struck me a bit weird, that it wasn't zero dot zero dot zero dot one.
It says, and I, and it sucks IPv6. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
The downside to this is that you cannot use this addresses.
I mean, with IPv4, you can use 127 slash 8, I think, for local addresses for loop back.
And this doesn't exist in IPv6 anymore. You just have this one local host address, which is colon colon one.
But of course, you've got the huge address space, you can juice.
Other addresses, if you want to from, from wherever, I mean, there is also, there is also a address base called.
It's called you, it's universe white.
I don't, I don't remember what this stands for. Those addresses are supposed to be globally unique, but not rooted on the internet.
So this is another address space you can use locally, if you want to.
Okay. Well, I guess that's been green for almost half an hour. So maybe, maybe it's time to wrap up.
But I've got one more question for you. Wait, we didn't, we didn't talk about the most important parts yet.
Oh, what's that?
The most important part is how do you make your home network IPv6 only and still talk to the internet, which is sadly not IPv6 only yet?
Okay. Actually, that's why I was green. In fact, that creation, I was about to ask you was related to that.
And as an editor, as your home network, IPv6 only now.
Let's say almost.
Because I do have a, I do have a heating controller, which insists on IPv4 DHCP addresses, DHCP assigned addresses.
And I do have a work laptop, which still doesn't fully work with IPv6 only.
Mostly due to 40, 40 VPN box. We're working on this. We're slowly getting there.
But at the moment, as you'll need IPv4 connectivity there. So what might set up looks like I've got a network that's.
That can be you sign pv6 only. And there is a special DHCP for option. It's called if the option 108.
And this is designed for the case where you do have IPv4 addresses that the DHCP can give out, but devices don't need them.
So basically, if a device comes to your DHCP for server and asks for address.
You handed over an address, but with the option 108 and this option means, well, if you are a device that's fully IPv6 capable, you don't have to configure this address.
You don't have to use the address because this network is fully IPv6 capable.
And then the devices can configure the IPv4 address. All I think maxed to this out of the box, iPhones, Android devices.
And Linux can be configured doing this. The point is, you need, okay, and that's the second part.
How do you do you even set up a IPv6 only network and still be able to talk to the internet out there, which is not IPv6 only?
Yes. That was the first thing you wanted to do. Yeah.
Exactly. And there are basically two things you need. One is, one thing is a transition on, on the border from your network to the internet.
You need a so-called not64. So you've got a not the translates IPv6 to IPv4.
The problem with this is, if your DNS gives you an IPv4 address, you've got no clue what the IPv6 address is, you have to connect to get to the not gateway.
And there is another mechanism called DNS64. So basically what DNS64 does, there is a special prefix. You can also choose another one, but there is a special prefix, six, four, colon, SF9B.
And what you do is you take this prefix and you just append the last 32 bits, you just append the IPv4 address.
And so now your device can use this IPv6 address to connect to your router and your router has this prefix configured as the not64 prefix.
And it knows, well, that's a not64 prefix. So I'll just throw the prefix away and take the IPv4 address from the last 32 bits and connect to whatever endpoint is IPv4 only.
And yeah, then the connection works. Of course, this is only necessary for endpoint to don't have an IPv6 DNS record.
So my DNS or the DNS64 does this only if there is no answer for a quality record for the endpoint you're trying to connect to.
Because if there is a quality record, you can obviously use IPv6 and everything works.
And then there is a second problem on the.
Sorry, before you go to that, yeah, so the would it be a router that handled that address?
Yes, yes. In my case, it's an open BSC box.
I will shamelessly plug my journey to Europe, BSD, come this year in September.
I'll try at least I'll try to give a talk about how to set up a IPv6 only home network using an open BSC router.
But usually it's handled. Yeah, it's you handled by your router and you're at DNS resolvers, of course, if that's not the same device.
I'd at home often it's the same device, but if you're in a corporate environment, then often the DNS resolver is a different device than your router.
Or it can be even the firewall, whatever your your edge device.
Okay, so actually I use Raspberry Pi to do the just as DNS inside my home network.
But it could also fulfill this purpose of being a bridge between IPv6 and IPv4 if my router didn't do it.
Is that possible?
Well, the main problem is that you then have to route traffic through your Raspberry Pi, which is possibly not powerful enough to handle all traffic.
And you can't I don't think you have a way to select well, of course you can select briefly route traffic to the Raspberry Pi or to your home router.
But then your routing rules are getting to be blown up and I think uses a lot of local routing configuration on your devices.
Okay, so it's not just dishing out an IPv6 address where one is required. It's actually routing is doing more than that.
It's the napsix for and the DNSix for they have to play together.
The napsix for synthesizes the fake address, so to say, and the napsix for and then translates this from an IPv6 and IPv4 connection.
Okay.
Okay, yeah, that makes sense. Yes, yeah, I didn't start at the first time, but now I do. Okay, yeah, so I interrupted you and you're about to go into something else.
What I was talking about is now is the translation from IPv6, IPv4 to connect to IPv4 endpoints on the internet, but the other thing also exists.
If you have some legacy piece of software that only accepts, I mean, there is like.
There is like a configuration field and says, well, enter IP address here and then you can enter exactly for for binds, right?
And of course, this software isn't going to connect to your router through and not six, four or any IPv6 address.
So there is a thing called CLAT, which is the client address sensation.
So this, the CLAT usually runs on your machine. It's built into max and Android phones and iPhones and there is a CLAT D that you can run on Linux.
And this gives you a network interface with an IPv4 address that then translates in the background translates connection to IPv6 to talk to your router.
So then your network is again IPv6 only.
Yeah, and I think that's it. That's all you need to have an IPv6 only network.
I mean, I think there are a lot of examples. A lot of this has been pushed by an engineer at Google.
I don't remember her name, but maybe I should look up the name for the show notes.
But she has pushed for for those transition mechanisms for Google to become an IPv6 only place or build an IPv6 only network inside the company and still be able to talk to the still existing IPv4 endpoints on the internet.
And I think also Facebook moved in this direction towards an IPv6 only network internally.
So I think it's it's actually happening not not on your home home internet, but I think on the wider internet that the move towards IPv6 is definitely there.
Okay, yeah, so it certainly seems that way. And yeah, so is there anything else you think we should talk about?
I don't think so. I mean, there is a lot to still talk about when it comes to IPv6.
And maybe one thing, I think for completeness, we should mention one thing because one thing people often complain about when it comes to IPv6 is privacy because, of course, you they consider network address translation privacy feature.
So you don't use your your IP address from your machine on the internet, but there are basically two things to to say against this one is the obvious obvious one they added not to IPv6 so you can, even though in the initial spec, it wasn't there.
Nowadays, you can have a nut for IPv6 if you want to. You shouldn't know it's a bad idea. It's a very bad idea, but if you want to, you can.
And there is how do you have a secure private network then.
There is a, there are privacy, there is an RFC about privacy extensions for IPv6 where the basic idea is that you have two different public addresses. One is the one that stays stable, that's used for inbound connections.
And the other one is used for outbound connections and you regenerate this address every delta T, you can choose it. I don't know what the default are.
I think like every hour, I'm just saying something, you generate that new address.
If you want to, you can even have your computer use different addresses for different things or different applications.
For IPv4 and that was designed as a method to stop them running out of addresses.
But it kind of ended up accidentally being a kind of not very good security mechanism that firewalls work with.
But that's not the case with IPv6 and that's why you're to avoid using that and IPv6.
Yeah, and I think that one of the benefits is that you don't have to deal with all the problems that come from, from that.
Like not being able to debug a connection end to end because the address is translated several times on the way and then you have to look at locks and well, you have to figure out, well, this addresses, this address was used.
But who initiated the connection and things like this, if you have like end to end visibility, then it's a lot easier to debug.
If something doesn't work, yeah, yeah, yeah, I can see yes, I can see that.
That makes a lot sense. Actually, I'd never really quite thought it through.
When you at the end node, then that not was a bit of a, a clutch.
Yeah, fashion order.
And I mean, I mean, you can, you can still.
I mean, that you have to configure your firewall to in a secure way to block and bound connections you don't want to have anyway.
There is not, not in IPB 4 is nothing excuse for a misconfigured or unconfigured in band firewall.
Yes, perfectly, perfectly possible to let bad things in.
Yeah, you sing.
Yeah, people do it all the time.
Yeah, yeah.
Nothing now we're getting closer to the hour. No, not yet. It's only 45 minutes.
Well, I think what I will do is you've kind of inspired me now to go and pay more attention to.
I mean, some of my devices I use every day for this laptop is why primarily for work.
So it's probably the last one that's, you know, it would be a real problem if this one.
I started, you know, if I misconfigured this internet.
Yeah, we're going to exist.
But there's a few other in my laptop that I use for other things in your laptop.
I should now configure that.
Pay more interest.
Take more, pay more attention to how that's configured in IPV 6 and see if I can turn off IPV 4.
And of course, there might be a, there might be another HPR.
I'm not a result of that.
Or there might not be because I'll have sealed myself off from the internet.
I'm totally happy to join again for any talk about the IPV 6 or the lack of IPV 4 or the matter.
And I was just about to look up the DNS of chatter sky haven.net.
Because we're recording.
Because I'm wondering whether the mumble server has IPV 6 or whether I'm actually talking through.
Wait, this is no correct.
Okay, well, it's.
I'm unable to find the correct record because I think mumble uses some meta records to find its end point to connect to.
So I can no clue what the actual IP addresses, but it runs.
I think it runs on class or so chances are that it works with IPV 6.
But otherwise, I was talking to you on an IPV 6 only laptop.
So at least the connection from my laptop to my router was IPv6.
Okay, for this episode.
Yeah, I have an IPv6 address for a charter.sky house in the net.
And I have a global IPv6 address for this laptop.
Okay.
And it might even have worked.
I can't tell which of the which which one I'm actually using.
I don't know.
Yeah, yeah.
Some rooting things which I'm not going to do now, but I am going to do that.
I'm going to find out because it's actually bothering me that I don't know whether I am using IPv4 or 6.
Well, obviously I'm not talking about my laptop.
I'd like to know which my laptop's using.
Yeah, but I could just turn one.
The simplest thing to do is turn one off and see if it still works.
Yeah, turn IPv4 off and then.
See whether it's a word.
I mean, a lot of things will break if you just turn off IPv4 without the transition mechanisms.
By the way, those mechanisms are called transition mechanisms because they're supposed to go away eventually.
They were designed to be something that only exists until IPv4 is gone.
So I don't know when this will be.
Yes, I mean, how many how many temporary things have been introduced that have never gone away?
Yeah, yeah.
I think I think the measurements of time you usually use for your stars and whatever astronomy.
I think they're more applicable here.
Like, I guess it's like thousands or billions of years until we can get rid of IPv4.
Yes, I suppose so.
We might, yes, but they never get rid of it because one one company with one killer application would let go of it.
Yeah.
I saw a somewhere on the internet.
I think it wasn't that diverse.
There was a command when.
Debian raised the size of the integer for time from 32 bits to 64 bits, avoiding the 23, the 2038 problem.
Yeah, well, yeah, the year when 32 bits are used up when you use the next time.
And then someone pointed out, well, you're only pushing the can down the road then that people in the year and then a huge number will have the same problem.
Yeah, and then someone else someone else commented, yeah, and this year will be only like 50 years after they finally introduced IPv6.
Yeah, well, I think that's probably a good place to leave it.
Yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely.
Well, thank you very much for joining me, Benny and particularly my, my, my stupid questions.
Yeah, thank you for asking questions because without questions, I usually don't know what to talk about on the HPR show.
So I always, always need someone to ask questions.
Excellent.
So if you've enjoyed this and you posted something wrong with what we've said or is inspired you to talk about your IPv6 set up so I can listen to it and get more information.
Then why not record an HPR show about that?
Yeah, that's definitely a plan because I'm sure there is a lot of things I got wrong here. So please correct me in another show.
Yeah, yeah.
And I'm sure there's many things I got wrong too, but Benny collected a lot of them so you don't need to.
Yeah, possibly wrongly so.
I'm sure not.
Okay.
Thank you for being my host for this episode.
You're most welcome.
Yeah, hopefully another IPv6 episode.
Yes, who knows.
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